With only three more days until pitchers & catchers report I figured I'd get this thread started with my take on a couple teams.

1. First off it looks like once again Mariner's GM Bill Bavasi is going for seasonal mediocrity and giving away too many players to get one. Bedard is good I'll admit but giving up George Sherill and four others to get him? I don't think so. Carlos Silva? There's a laugh. Just like with Jeff Weaver last year, this year Bill Bavasi is once again going to be the laughingstock of Major League General Managers. Once again he grossly overpays for extremely mediocre "Talent". Why Ichiro signed to finish his career with this team is a mystery to me. Bill needs to be shown the door but seeing as how he was resigned for a couple more years it looks like M's fans will have to put up with his antics for an extended engagement. If the Mariners even win 90 games this year I'll be VERY surprised.

Hey Anaheim, you guys want this clown back?

2. It looks like the Yankees are going to once again have the highest payroll in the Majors but I don't think they'll do much in the post season. Of course that is if they even get there. The roster is pretty much the same as last year and granted they had some injuries they barely managed to sneak into the playoffs.

3. Hopefully the Rockies will continue their success of last year.

4. My prediction for the World Series - Boston Red Sox repeat as MLB Champs.

So says the Swami.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 2/10/2008).]

If this sort of "Team Play" keeps up I can see McLaren getting the boot during the All-Star game. The question remains as to who would take his place. I'm not sure who's out there or who would even want to come to this poor excuse for a team/organization. The team needs a top-down firesale and needs it fast. I recently read somewhere that the Mariners are in the dubious position of being so far behind that they have virtually no hope of getting anywhere close to the post-season.

1. Chuck Armstrong

2. Bill Bavasi

3. John McLaren

...Need to go in that order.

I completely agree with that order.

I think no team who has ever been more than 16 games under .500, has EVER made it to the post season.

Not sure how far back the Mariners are now, but probably pretty damn close. In any case, they will NEVER make it to the post season ... not this year any way.

I think they should also deal anyone that can get them some young arms and hitters. I heard they're 7-20 in their last 27.

Calling this team "mediocre", Webmaster, is like calling a fence lizard Godzilla.

I had a lot of hope for this team this spring. Man, have they sucked!

This is just priceless!

Bavasi says he's mostly stuck with current M's
http://www.komonews.com/n...86769.html

Bavasi said again McLaren's job is not the issue, that his players are.

"I can't make a deal anyway right now that's worth a damn," Bavasi said.

He couldn't make deals worth a damn to begin with much less right now. It looks like Sexson (who's getting $14 million this season) and Jose Vidro are going to be the first to go. From Sexson's reaction to Bavasi's order to stay put for a team meeting it looks like he sees the writing on the wall.

He did not follow Bavasi's unusual order that all players man their posts immediately after Wednesday's loss. He appeared about 15 minutes into the availability, showered and dressed, for a brief walk-by of his locker before disappearing into an off-limits eating area.

Let the implosion continue.

I must say, on accassion... once, Kyle you are right. I mean, about the Mariners sucking. The need to fire Bavasi has never been a point of discussion. If he isn't toast this year, I'm finding a new team to root for. I suppose he'll make sure to screw us for the future and resign Richie long-term. There isn't any deals worth a damn because there aren't any players worth a damn - watch him send off Felix, Morrow, Clement, and Ballentein because we need a veteran presence.

One thought driven home is better than three left on base.

Well now that he's hit number 600 hopefully the Mariners and Reds can get something done to bring him back home. Congrats to The Kid on 600 homeruns.

Would he really want to join that mess?

By the way, the Mariners fired their hitting coach. Look for a HUGE
turnaround.

Bob,

They're going to have to fire at least three more people inorder to turn this team around. As usual the M's front office misses the point and only addresses one-one thousandth of the problem this team has.

Here are the changes I would make to the front office from the top on down.

Those Deserving Of Pink Slips On Wednesday:

Howard Lincoln
Chuck Armstrong
Bill Bavasi
John McLaren
Richie Sexson
Kenji Johjima

The list goes on.......

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 6/10/2008).]

I agree,Kyle. I was being sarcastic. Maybe they should find some sluggers and enclose that stadium to give the ball some carry. Small-ball doesn't work in the AL. In the mean time, the entire organization needs to be reworked.

This really sums up Bavasi's work:

http://seattletimes.nwsou...tes26.html

You know, that it's a bad contract.

[This message has been edited by Buck Showalter (edited 6/11/2008).]

Buck,

What's even sadder is that because of the contract extension, I can say with almost 100% certainty that Jeff Clement will be gone by the time Kenji's new contract is up.

Jeff ought to start packing his bags now. On the plus side however at least he'll be going to a better team with a manager who knows Clement's value.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 6/12/2008).]

Here's a good summary and lead up to the implosion now occurring:

http://baseballanalysts.c...foible.php

I don't really see this as an implosion. It's more like putrifaction.

Interesting trade rumors already - talking about shipping Bedard out, hope he gives us a few good starts, get his value up a little.

Buck,

Where did you hear this rumor? It seems about right for Bavasi: Get reamed in a trade deal and then turn around and deal the guy you got reamed for. I have no idea who'd they trade for but Griffey comes to mind but I doubt they'd do that.

Then again this IS Bill Bavasi we're talking about here.

They're talking about sending him to the Phillies for prospects, probably not a bad idea considering they paid the farm for him.

http://www.mlbtraderumors...d-spe.html

Gillick is with the Phillies, so they have that little connection going.

[This message has been edited by Buck Showalter (edited 6/13/2008).]

It's too late ... why would Jr. want to go to a team being run by "The Three Stooges" currently sitting in LAST PLACE OF ALL MLB?

Most likely, we'll see him for a very, very short period right before he retires -- finishing his career, hopefully, in a final blaze of glory as a Mariner.

Unfortunately, that will probably be in 2010 or so ... thanks again BILL.

Same old Mariners. They have a 4-1 lead going into the 8th inning and then just give it to the Braves. Pack your bags Batista you won't have a job much longer with such a "Stellar" performance.

I guess on the plus side they at least HAD a lead going into the 8th but the "Good Ol' Mariners" rear their heads once more.

Ok as if this season wasn't weird already Felix Hernandez, yes the PITCHER of all people, gives the Mariners the lead with a Grand Slam? WTF? This season just keeps getting stranger and stranger.

As of 5:20pm

****! Felix was pitching a gem of a game and now goes down with an injury. Hopefully it isn't too serious but judging by the look on his face it could be bad.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 6/23/2008).]

Felix says he should make his next start.

Mariners won tonight 11-0 over the Mets. Dickey looked decent. WTF?

Back to form tonight.

Here's something for Mariner fans to discuss here: What is the consensus on Mariner's play-by-play man, Dave Niehaus heading to Cooperstown? Is it deserved or not? Considering he's missed roughly 82 games out of the nearly 5,000 the Mariners have played since their inception I'd say he's deserving of the honor. I'm looking forward to seeing his speech and the special tomorrow on FSN about his first trip to the Hall Of Fame.

On another note it looks like the M's are doing pretty well tonight. Hopefully they can start improving now but jettisoning Batista, Silva, Vidro & Sexson would make for a good first start.

Also it's good to see Washburn getting some run support FINALLY. He should have at least four more wins on his record but he either got no run support or the bullpen blew the lead he had when he left. Hopefully they'll be able to hold it tonight.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 6/27/2008).]

I like Dave. The fact he hasn't blown his own brains out after seeing that many Mariners games ought to get him into the Hall.

The Mariners did win tonight...but it was against the Padres....cellar dwellers in the weakest division in the MLB. The D-backs are 40-40 but lead the division.

[This message has been edited by Bob Netherton (edited 6/27/2008).]

Wow, how about that game last night! Adrian Beltre tomahawks a homerun to get the M's within 1 of Toronto. Then Richie Sexson of all people blasts a homerun in the bottom of the 8th to tie it up. Then as if that wasn't weird enough Willie Bloomquist drives in the winning run in the bottom of the 9th.

They maybe 20+ games back in the AL West but it looks like a vastly different team with Riggleman at the helm than with MacLaren and Bavasi. They seem to be having a lot more fun and seem to be looser than they were at the start of the year.

Perhaps they can make a good run at West.

Perhaps.

I must say that I'm starting to be increasingly impressed with the Mariners performances as of late. It seems that the pitching is slowly starting to come around (Carlos Silva being the exception) and that they're doing the little things necessary to win games. They certainly stumble every now and then but it's nowhere near what it was a couple months ago. Brandon Morrow and Ryan Rowland-Smith are looking really good as is the rest of the bullpen.

I'm a little disappointed with the play of Jeff Clement but he is a rookie after all and that will all sort itself out.

While I don't expect them to make a serious run at the playoffs it looks like things are starting to come around for the M's.

All of a sudden they're playing like superstars baby ... perhaps instead of a 106 loss season they'll hit my mark of .500 (give or take a game).

You may need to pay Buck that 6-pack of beer after all if this keeps up.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 7/9/2008).]

Although I relieved Buck from his obligation, and as Bob Netherton mentioned above "whatever happened to hope springs eternal", I still think the Mariners are going to end up at least 10 back from our bet ... so pretty sure I'm still safe.

Since Bavasi and McLaren both got canned and rumors of the old Nintendo man in Japan wanting to sell his share to a Microsoft partner in the ownership group ... I'm now rooting for them, instead of against them ...

Tides are a changing, but my god, it will probably take forever ...

Well seeing as how they just jettisoned Richie Sexson the "Tides Of Change" are looking oh so good! Goodbye Mr. "$7 million for a .215 average"! It looks like the last of Bavasi's mistakes are being purged and man does it feel good.

Amen. Vidro needs to go next. Since he'll be getting more playing time now, I'm guessing if he continues to suck ... it won't be long.

I've heard trade rumors of Adrian Beltre going to the Phillies, and Bedard going somewhere as well. I'd like to seem them keep Beltre as he's pretty damn good at 3rd. His bat might not be totally there but it's good enough.

Vidro just sucks, plain and simple. The guy's also a major headcase. The same goes for Bedard. The guy won't pitch past 100 pitches and gets injuries every other game? Ship him off as well.

I have to say I like Jim Riggleman and the job he's been doing. Hopefully he can keep it up.

If Silva and Bedard had delivered half of what was expected, The Mariners might be in almost decent shape. Now they both look like total mistakes. I agree....ship'em. Dickey has looked good at times.
I was pulling for Sexson but enough is enough.

Is there any decent talent down on the farm?

No trade looming for Bedard, as he is on disabled list, both physically and mentally it appears. His shoulder has been sore all year, and we would have to give him away now. I don't think even the Yankees are that dumb. If he comes back and gets 2 quality starts, Steinbrenner might just bail us out. We can only hope at this point. I am going to miss Richie, but it was time to move on. I think I could hit .211, for half that money. I just hope they shopped him some before giving him his outright release. Do we get some relief if he get's picked up by another club?

With all this talk of the Olympics I've forgotten how the Mariners are doing. Let's see shall we.

Hmmm, out of 18 games played in the month of August the Mariners have lost 13 with only 5 wins to show. It looks like they're back to their usual routine of getting shelled in the first 4 innings with the rest of the team looking to climb out of a big hole.

So since the last post in this topic on the 10th of July the Mariners have played a total of 35 games and have lost 25 of them, winning 10.

Like the old song goes:

"So welcome back baby, to the poor side of town."

Yeah, it is so depressing (not only for this year, but for some to come) ... I haven't found the strength to do my bitch rant.

Basically, they are playing for last place in all of MLB ... and they are even losing at that ... I believe they're currently second.

Now, if they come in last place, I think they get 1st pick and a really awesome stud is up for grabs ... unfortunately, the Mariners will screw this up too and come in 2nd place ... and lose that pick.

After watching Minnesota spank them using their patented small ball type play, at a fraction of the cost, I've considered becoming a Twins fan ... although that new stadium they're building scares me. I can't imagine a game there in early April.

This is far too funny. I just went to the M's website and they don't even HAVE the AL West Standings up there anymore.

http://seattle.mariners.m...p?c_id=sea

(Enter at your own risk)

I guess they don't want people to know just how far out of anything the M's truly are.

The Angeles on the other hand.....

http://losangeles.angels....p?c_id=ana

TEAM W L % GB
Los Angeles 76 48 .613 -
Texas 62 65 .488 15.5
Oakland 57 69 .452 20.0
Seattle 46 80 .365 31.0

Ouch.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 8/20/2008).]

31 games back, in your own division, which is the smallest of all MLB (as it only has 4 teams) is pretty damn bad. I wonder if the old Mariners from 1993 or before were ever that horrible -- especially considering the revenue the M's bring in.

Wasn't there something several years ago, give or take, that stated the Mariners organization was one of the most profitable sports franchises in existence at the time?

http://en.wikipedia.org/w...ers_season

This is sad. They're a little behind pace to eclipse the '92 team as being the worst ever in M's history. Only 19 more games to go and they do it.

They've got 36 games left on the docket and with them losing 25 of their last 35 I think it's highly doable.

I also see Junior finally hit a home run ... it's apparent he's not the same kid as before, he's more of an old man ... I didn't watch the game, but I root for him ... if he wouldn't have suffered the injuries, he would be the home run king ... (with no asterisk)

http://sports.espn.go.com...=280820104

And oh, yeah, nice job Mariners ...

Well here it is nearly 2 weeks until the end of the season and thumbing through the posts here I came across this little wager:

MilesCity.com Webmaster: Anyone want to make a wager? Mariners win 90+ in 2008, I owe you a six pack. Mariners win less than 90, you owe me a six pack.

Buck Showalter: I'm in. Whadya like?
And if they win 90, I'll just take the satisfaction.

Current Mariners record:

Seattle W-55 L-86 %.390 Games Back - 30.0

Hope you've got your favorite one all picked out Webmaster. 55 wins with only 21 games left. They only need to win one to avoid the distinction of having the worst record in Mariners history. Even this team isn't that pathetic and should win 65 this season which would place them, not counting the 2 strike years 6th on the list.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w...rs_seasons

Hooray for futility!

Incidentally, in reading this thread in its entirety I think the Swami hit the bullseye on his prediction

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 9/7/2008).]

Every dog has his day.

Here's a sad statistic for Mariners fans.

Felix Hernandez failed tonight in his bid to become the 1st Mariners pitcher this season have double-digit (10+) wins.

Ouch!

Great Quote of The Day:

I've seen statues at first base that move faster than you. - Dave Simms Mariner Commentator on Carlos Delgato re. Carlo's performance early in the season.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 9/24/2008).]

Why were they talking about Delgado?... Who did in fact have an amazing year despite the choke artist club he plays for.

Evidently he was getting some crap in June from the Mets fans.

I will admit though Kyle, you were right. I think it was probably a 75% chance that you'd be right and 25% for me. This is a team that had the talent to win, but not the attitude - now it's time to rebuild, a process that I usually enjoy were it not for the horrible management of the team. Why are Ibanez, Washburn, Beltre, Batista, and everyone else over the age of 30 still on the roster? Maybe no one wants Washburn or Batista, but there is no excuse to not trade Beltre and Ibanez.

Other season highlights - Richie Sexson charges the mound - that ball was no where close to his head, which explains his ability to strike out on pitches low and four feet outside the strike zone.

McLaren blows his top - doesn't matter, this team was prepared to continue losing, but it's a decent rant.

Tug Huelett - gotta love that name.

I caught a couple of Tacoma Rainiers games this season and there's a lot of good talent down there that I think should be brought up. Toui, Tug and a couple others I can't recall off-hand. Beltre I like but he hasn't produced much and liking a player doesn't produce wins. Raul should be traded as his stock has gone up these past couple months.

One guy I really like is Ryan Rowland-Smith. I think this guy has got some really good stuff and should make a great starter next year for the Mariners.

This season I think was just a fluke. I think they'll probably be a lot better next year.

I hope.

WoooHooo! Pop the cork Mariner fans it's time to celebrate! The Mariners have just made history by becoming the first team to lose 100 games with a 100 million dollar payroll.

Congratulations Mariners:



I thought this was pretty funny:

A Morsel Of Goodness This Mariners Season
http://www.pimpstyle2000....hread=2299

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (edited 9/24/2008).]