Internet weapons
Posted by Merry DeAnda (+1849) 9 years ago
After the recent massacre in Aurora, Colorado and the ease of purchasing weapons, ammo and body armor over the internet.

My question to this forum is? Should there be a ban on assault type (military type weapons) and is too easy to obtain weapons, ammunition, and protective gear over the internet

I am just wondering?

[This message has been edited by Merry DeAnda (7/22/2012)]
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Posted by Levi Forman (+3712) 9 years ago
No.
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Posted by Monica LN (+148) 9 years ago
If it was as easy for James Holmes to obtain all that firepower as it should be for law abiding citizens to carry (concealed or not), he would have been detained as soon as he was noticed.

The old saying is that "guns kill people." Well now its the internet's fault for making it easier to buy supplies like that of J.H.
Can we say the internet kills people? Or can we prosecute the people who sell these items on the internet? How about those they purchased from? How far back do you want to go?
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Posted by Steve Allison (+981) 9 years ago
From what I have heard on the news, he did not get the guns over the internet and I believe it is already illegal it do so. He got body armor and bullets. Body armor is protective gear. Are you saying this should not be available? I do not feel the need for any myself but some people at the local VFW may feel differently. As for the ammunition, how much is too much? A few trips to local stores could get one the same amounts with no one thinking anything about it either. This event is a tragedy and it would be wonderful if some kind of regulation would prevent something similar from ever happening again but I don't see how one could be set up to do what you are hopping for.
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Posted by Gunnar Emilsson (+17321) 9 years ago
I think that instead of banning guns and ammo, we should ban Batman movies.
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Posted by cubby (+2629) 9 years ago
I'll say it again,,,,,,guns don't kill people, people kill people.
I wish people would quit trying to blame all this on guns.
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Posted by Elizabeth Emilsson (+797) 9 years ago
I know I wouldn't be caught dead at a Batman movie at midnight in Aurora.
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Posted by Simon Niece (+301) 9 years ago
I think Levi already nailed it on the head.
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Posted by Exalted Buckaroo (+249) 9 years ago
Have it your way, Cubby:
Guns don't kill people, Americans kill people.


Among the 23 industrialized nations, 80% of deaths by firearms routinely occur within the U.S. and the state of Montana ranks #6 in the nation for deaths by gun violence per capita.
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founder
Posted by David Schott (+17053) 9 years ago
Does that "#6" ranking include suicide?
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Posted by SD (+1525) 9 years ago
Perhaps we should just turn in our firearms and trust our Government. I do believe the founding fathers warned against just that sort of thing.
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Posted by neonfreedom (+290) 9 years ago
I'll say it again,,,,,,guns don't kill people, people kill people.
I wish people would quit trying to blame all this on guns.<---I agree and disagree...people do kill people but it is the BULLET from that GUN that kills the other person...(And yes i know thats an obvious statement but i made it any ways)

[This message has been edited by neonfreedom (7/23/2012)]
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Posted by Richard Bonine, Jr. (+14950) 9 years ago
Perhaps we should just turn in our firearms and trust our Government. I do believe the founding fathers warned against just that sort of thing.


I wonder if the founding fathers envisioned the havoc that could be wrought upon us with an AK-47 or similar assalt rifle?
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Posted by Monica LN (+148) 9 years ago
If a mechanic does a sh!tty job fixing your car, is it his fault or his tools?

A doctor can get sued for malpractice for obvious reasons- is his patient's life in his hands or his equipment?

You cannot BLAME inanimate objects for what people use them for!
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Posted by David Schott (+17053) 9 years ago
Nuclear weapons for everyone, then?
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Posted by Exalted Buckaroo (+249) 9 years ago
Funny thing, SD, the 42 mass murders that have occurred in the U.S. over the past 30 years were committed, with one exception, by lone gunmen, not our Government.
http://www.motherjones.co...otings-map

(Sorry, Merry, your thread's been hijacked. Want us to take this gun fight outside?)

David - The stats are for all deaths by firearms and, so, would include suicides. Gun violence is gun violence. Source: Center for Disease Control.
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Posted by Buck Showalter (+4461) 9 years ago
I don't see any red dots in God's country.
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Posted by Steve Allison (+981) 9 years ago
The trouble with this argument is both sides are right to some extent. It takes a person loading, handling and pulling the trigger of a gun to kill someone. That person is morally and legally responsible for that death. But the other side is the power of a gun makes an attack more deadly. The man in Colorado could not have killed and injured so many people with a knife or sword. Arguing the issue back and forth just shows you are not considering the other's point of view. Arguing where to draw a line on sale and ownership and how to enforce it would be a bit more useful.
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Posted by Buck Showalter (+4461) 9 years ago
This whole thread just shows me that no one is awake. Those 40 mass murderers had something more important in common and sometimes I think the gun discussion is had so we can avoid the real issue. Our treatment of the mentally ill in this country is a procreateing joke. You can't reach out for help without being ashamed and it's damn near impossible to get help for someone you know who needs it. One of these days you're all going to realize more duct tape isn't the solution.

And for the inner city gun issues - hope. That simple. They have strict gun laws in Chicago, they have strict penalties for people who use guns, and yet there are still guns and still shootings because there is no hope.
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Posted by Wendy Wilson (+6165) 9 years ago
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Posted by Buck Showalter (+4461) 9 years ago
He didn't seem too concerned about breaking the law. He'd have had a gun. Period.

[Edit]
33 homicides in Chicago this month (still 8 nights to go!), that nobody gives 2 squirts over, is why the subject requires further evaluation. I don't know why I'm being polite, I don't feel polite.
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Posted by Merry DeAnda (+1849) 9 years ago
Buck Showalter.."Our treatment of the mentally ill in this country is a procreateing joke. You can't reach out for help without being ashamed and it's damn near impossible to get help for someone you know who needs it."

I agree with you. It was exactly the same while I was in the military. If you did reach out, there was a good chance you would lose your security clearance , thus your job . So.. if you said you had a problem, and spoke about it, then you knew it would be a career ender for you.

I realize what you all are saying, however go to the internet and type in "How to buy Assault Weapon online" and you will see that there are many sites that sell assault weapons, as well as Body armor, etc.

I am not saying that am I against owning weapons, however. I do have a problem with the owning of assault weapons. I used all the assault weapons the military had while I was in the army. However, I do not feel they have a place in our civilian society. Military environment YES!!, Civilian environment / life No!!

Do you really need a semi - automatic weapon to kill your deer or elk?

If you do I would think that maybe you need to take up fishing without the weapon.

It is funny, when you ask a question about weapons in Montana and about gun ownership. and the weapons that are needed . . the majority of people become up in arms about their rights. I am not saying take away your arms. All I saying and asking do we really need to have the ability to buy assault weapons, over 6000 rounds, and body armor over the internet.

Would your thoughts be different if one of the 12 causality were your next of kin?



[This message has been edited by Merry DeAnda (7/23/2012)]

[This message has been edited by Merry DeAnda (7/23/2012)]
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supporter
Posted by Buck Showalter (+4461) 9 years ago
Would your thoughts be different if one of the 12 causality were your next of kin?


No.

Emotions make people irrational. The suggested fix doesn't work. Prohibition is a failure. Prohibition of drugs, liquor, abortion, weapons, whatever you want, always a failure. Sad but true. Use your head. Understand the problem. Fix the problem.

And you want to know why I say, "No"? Because people I know have died due to gun violence. They didn't get a glamorous mass murder that, "could have been any one of us." I don't need a news story to force me to think about this poop. Blech, you all make me barf. Peace out.
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Posted by Merry DeAnda (+1849) 9 years ago
I understand about the emotions!

What would you suggest to " Understand the problems and Fixing the Problem"
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Posted by Buck Showalter (+4461) 9 years ago
Mental health, prison reform, education, and jobs. I'm high on powdered unicorn horn, though.

That's just for this problem. (Two problems - one that gets ignored and one that gets attention)
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Posted by Levi Forman (+3712) 9 years ago
Mass shootings are scary and dramatic, but as far as national problems they are on par with shark attacks. Not something to base policy on and as Buck suggests, mental health is the real issue. Gun control doesn't have a good record at reducing crime. The gang bangers that do most of the murdering in the US don't buy guns legally or give a damn whether or not they are legal.

Here's the murder rate for the UK over the last 50 years (Source):



Look at 1997, where the UK banned all handguns. The murder rate went up sharply for the next 5 years. Not a great advertisement for gun control. It wasn't just murder either, it was all crime, including violent crime and even gun related crime. Australia banned guns after a mass shooting with similar results. I'm not saying that banning guns causes crime to increase, although there are those that do, but crime is a complex issue and from what I have seen gun laws are not a major factor in the rate of crime even though it seems like they would be.

Gun control laws only effect people who follow the laws. They take guns away from people like you and me and not from the people who are likely to use them for violence. It's an easy knee-jerk reaction but it has never been especially effective and does more harm than good to those that value their gun rights.

[This message has been edited by Levi Forman (7/23/2012)]
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Posted by Frank Hardy (+1607) 9 years ago
What brought about the decline starting in 2002?

FH
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Posted by Levi Forman (+3712) 9 years ago
Good question. I don't know.
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Posted by Bob Netherton II (+1905) 9 years ago
All of those handguns people hoarded before the ban started to wear out.

Does anyone remember when the NRA, fearing new gun laws, used to say 'Enforce the laws we have'. Why the procreate are they no longer happy with the laws we have? I'll tell you. The NRA needs money and power. Unless you can dream up solutions to problems that don't exist, who needs you?

I have to hand it to the NRA. Anyone, no matter how competant can easily get a gun any time he wants, any kind he wants and probabaly wherever he wants.

[This message has been edited by Bob Netherton II (7/23/2012)]
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Posted by Roy Simanton (+60) 9 years ago
When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will carry guns.
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Posted by Elizabeth Emilsson (+797) 9 years ago
Jut another thought or this thread. With al the ammo , supplies to booby trap his apartment. this guy operated without the notice of anyone. No agency was alerted over the amount of ammo, the delivery people, Neighbors noticed Nothing??? What if he had a Muslim Name?
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Posted by Frank Hardy (+1607) 9 years ago
I would think the goofy orange hair might have caught someone's eye.

FH
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Posted by Brandon Loomis (+96) 9 years ago
Roy Simanton what are you doing on Milescity.com. Shouldn't you be sniffing out some ied in Afghanistan. Which brings up a good point IED's are very easy to come by, if I didn't have a gun I would just build one of those. Actually I would just build one of those in the first place, he could have taken out the whole theater with the press of a button. Frank clearly you haven't been to a large opening these days its quite common to see people dressed up even grown adults.
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Posted by Roy Simanton (+60) 9 years ago
Brandon, definately still in Afghanistan. Wish I was in Ohio like it says I am??
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