Let's try a new emoticon. That would be -> :mc:

Nice. Glad you have it properly centered and all, unlike the new ClockTower in MC...

It also would make a nice brand Rocking MC I wonder if it is registered.

Whoever came up with the logo is a procreating genius, I tells ya.

Yes, it is registered and trade marked.

Just curious, who made the MC logo anyway? I created the emoticon, but there's no way it's a trademark violation.

I've been in trademark battles in the past, and the way the whole thing works is like this -- there are federally registered trademarks that have the circle (R) attached, and there are general trademarks that have the TM attached (or simply an announcement that something is being declared as a trademark).

Trademarks can only be declared and defended. If federally registered there's a higher hill to climb in regards to declaring, but a lower to climb in regards to defending.

Stardust Technologies got into it with me over Stardust Software. They had the federal registered (R) trademark, but I beat them in a legal squabble because I had prior use (they just dropped the entire threatened lawsuit once it was made apparent to them they would lose their federal registration if they continued pursuing me). Also, while unimportant, Stardust Technologies no longer exists, and Stardust Software still does.

In any case, the Flickr photo taken from the road has the logo, and there is no trademark notice attached to it -- so it is not a valid display for protection, it actually unprotects it. No matter what, you absolutely must legally defend a trademark to protect it. Any reasonable lapse of doing so causes it to become invalid.

I seriously doubt could be trademarked now anyway, considering the way it's been misused, and there really needs to be a market conflict in order to raise any sort of claim. That's why Stardust Casino has nothing to do with Stardust Software in the trademark arena, although Stardust Casino is no longer around either.

The person who originally created the logo, holds a copyright over it, unless they've specifically stated it is public domain.

However, copyright law is very complex, and does not work the way you think it does. You can't bring any case to court without federal registration. Also, if you register late (as in after 90 days from original creation) you forfeit statutory damages and are only then allowed actual damages.

I can't imagine any actual damages could possibly exist in regards to that logo though, because you would have to prove an income from it and any damages an alleged infringement caused, which is basically impossible. If timely registered, you wouldn't have to prove anything, you automatically receive statutory damages which has a minimum and maximum amount. The Berne Convention supersedes Federal Copyright Law, so it is first and foremost, and then falls back to the U.S. Law for anything not covered.

It looks like a brand. "Rocking M C"

Well, if it's a brand, then that's a completely different issue. If it is one, who registered / owns it?

In any case, the Flickr photo taken from the road has the Miles City logo, and there is no trademark notice attached to it -- so it is not a valid display for protection, it actually unprotects it. No matter what, you absolutely must legally defend a trademark to protect it. Any reasonable lapse of doing so causes it to become invalid.

The avatar for the group taken from the photo - the green highway sign?

I took the photo of the green highway sign, and I don't think there are any copyright or trademarks attached to things like that. I believe in that circumstance, the image belongs to me, but not the use of "miles city." Don't know that you can trademark or copyright the name of a city. If so, Miles City, Florida is in violation!! Dan asked for, and received permission from me, to use it for the Flickr avatar. It's from the Flickr group about Miles City, which is a cool group of photos.

I think I remember reading that the was someone's brand locally and then it was purchased for the city's use. ?? I like it.

[This message has been edited by Sarah Peterson (10/26/2010)]

Dan Mowry wrote:

The avatar for the group taken from the photo - the green highway sign?

No, this one (photo taken by Alison):



http://www.flickr.com/pho...-milescity

Sarah Peterson wrote:

I took the photo of the green highway sign

It's a cool photo, I appreciate images like that. It captures a tiny little piece of something. You definitely own the copyright to that photo, but the state can't trademark or copyright or whatever that particular sign. Your photo is different though, because it's your artistic work, you captured it.

It is a brand and I believe it's registered to Kelly Reid. While it is being marketed as a "rocking MC", the brand itself is actually called "an MC sitting in a quarter circle". If it was a true "rocking MC" brand, the MC would be attached to the quarter circle thus making it a "rocker". All in all, doesn't make that much difference.

If it was a true "rocking MC" brand, the MC would be attached to the quarter circle thus making it a "rocker". All in all, doesn't make that much difference.

Until you have to put a miserable three-iron brand on a calf and have it turn out as bloch bar scab.

John Morford wrote:

It is a brand and I believe it's registered to Kelly Reid.

Well, I don't know how registered brands actually work, especially when that's in Montana and I'm in Washington, and we're talking about a web site vs. a cows ass, so if anyone who owns or has licensed it has a problem with the emoticon, please let me know, and I'll remove it from use.

When I posted about this I was not even thinking about it being any kind of violation. I was wondering if it was a livestock brand.

It is a licensed brand and, as far as I know, only in Montana. I can't see a problem with emoticon but I suppose if Kelly Reid has a problem, he'll let you know. I doubt it. He registered it with the intention of using it to promote Miles City.

I am a little confused here. Is is a registered livestock brand owned by Kelly Reid or is this a brand that is licensed somehow for promotional issues, or both?

I also am confused by the brand/logo. I see it on the "Miles City" sign off the interstate, it hangs on a clock tower, it's painted on a bunch of dumpsters, I've seen it on a hotel door and various other signs and posters that seem to be unrelated to each other. What is the purpose of it? Usually a logo is connected to a single organization. I'm assuming that this one is, but I just can't figure out who. It's visually pretty nice , I just wonder what it represents.

It's also in other places such as this (photo taken by Dave):



http://www.flickr.com/pho...-milescity

Kelly Reid registered it as a brand in the state of Montana and lets folks use it for promotional purposes. I don't think he actually sticks it on any cattle but I believe he could. At one time, I think the CoC had it registered but let the registration lapse.

It promotes Miles City. Not one single organization or event but the whole oeuvre that is Miles City and its environs. It's cool and western and just is. Very zen.

[This message has been edited by Amorette Allison (10/26/2010)]

So it just means that you are geographically located in Miles City? Isn't that a given? Someone could just as well hang it on their church, or put it on the roof of their porn store. It essentially has no, or very little meaning. If it were representing a specific aspect of Miles City than it could be useful. For example, Downtown Bozeman is a brand, and thus has brand guidelines. The Downtown Bozeman logo is strategically placed and represents a very specific and clear idea. doesn't appear to represent anything, other than "I am located in the town of Miles City...along with everything else in Miles City".

Seems like poor usage of a nice logo.

There is also a difference between registering the brand for use on cattle, and registering it for ornamental use...

http://liv.mt.gov/liv/BE/...dsInfo.asp

http://www.flickr.com/pho...117903251/

That's a good one Dave. Instead of the Pumpkin hunt, how about a hunt?

A very similar logo is used by a ladies western wear company in Colorado called Rocking MC.
I could see this logo getting used a lot in Miles City, and might be recognized wherever it is seen all over Custer County, then others. Eventually all over Montana and the surrounding states. It could be on the back of every car and pickup from Miles.
Anything to promote your town and to show pride in it. There's nothing wrong with that, hopefully anyone who claims ownership of that logo would agree.

Dave's image would look better if he photoshopped Bert's back legs sticking out of the dumpster.

Spacekace: Thanks for answering my question.

Gunnar: Do you have any idea how much a new mac keyboard will cost me.

[This message has been edited by Richard Bonine, Jr (10/26/2010)]

You register a brand for a certain location on a cow or horse, say left hip. Someone else can register the same brand on the right hip,jaw shoulder or hip. So who ever owns a brand only has rights to the said location of the brand.

I'm not sure but I think this was the 2008 (?) version of the Miles City Chamber of Commerce Christmas tree ornament.



http://www.flickr.com/pho...231863103/



http://www.flickr.com/pho...232455742/