Its bad enough being a high school dropout, but a godless high school dropout? For shame.



"Godless, rude, and stupid is no way to go through life, son"

"If we make our goal to live a life of compassion and unconditional love, then the world will indeed become a garden where all kinds
of flowers can bloom and grow."
Dr. Elisabeth Kübler-Ross, Late Author of On Death and Dying

I'm confused. Being a high school dropout is a good thing?

I work with students unable to make it in a regular school system. We need more alternative schools for kids who don't have the same tools as the others have.

Its bad enough being a high school dropout, but a godless high school dropout? For shame.

This is a not so veiled swipe at Josh.
Surely that is obvious.

Funny, I thought it was a swipe at all the holier-than-thou's who keep taking swipes at Josh.

Eh, I can care less. If they have this much free time, and nothing to do with it let them.

And exactly what tools are kids missing that other kids have? I watched as "alternative students" were given every leeway imaginable because they couldn't fit in with regular students. That included....cigarette breaks!

Just because polar bear said it, doesn't make it wrong, Kacey.

Alternative kids often don't learn well via traditional methods. They sometimes need more and sometimes need less choices. They need teachers who understand both their limitations and understand their needs. We have more and more alternative kids partially because we are raising more eccentric kids and partly due to the fact that we have more damaged kids than ever before. Neurologically, we have far, far more kids who are not wired like previous generations. I highly recommend "Ghosts from the Nursery".

Additionally kids with lower intelligence are often left behind in the regular classroom and never get caught up. They tend to drop out by grade 10 knowing they cannot begin to compete. People who don't graduate HS are more likely statistically to be unable to get jobs, have problems keeping jobs, have trouble getting along with people in general.

"Alternative kids"- would that be Goth?

yeah, your typical goth/stoner high school population.

Actually it is funny. The "Alternative School" kids in CCDHS last year were normal. They just didn't learn well in large classes.

There's always beauty school to drop out of ...

Before you all take swipes at the dropouts/alternative school kids maybe you should talk to some of them. I, for one, graduated from alternative high school after switching to it due to the plain and simple fact that I needed to work to survive due to parents who thought that because I was old enough to have a job I was old enough to live on my own and fend for myself. I was not a stoner, a goth, or any other crappy label you can think up. Just someone who had to grow up at the age of 16, work 2 jobs, plus go to school. And you know what? I am just as successful, if not more successful, as someone who graduated out of the main high school education. I am not the only person who was like this in my class either. I will admit there were some people who could have been put under one of your petty little labels, but not all of them.

I'm not advocating dropping out of high school, it is the hard path, however, I thought we already went through all this before ... the highest level of "officially completed" education I received was as a sophomore at CCDHS, although I did pursue education after. Since then I think I've kind of done okay. After all, Melinda French delivered Dove bars, in person, to my desk, in my office with a window, at Microsoft.

Would you like to talk about fast Fourier transformations or convolution filters?

I dropped out of CCDHS. Which was a mistake, and made me jump through more hoops then I normally would have. I am know in my second year of grad school, and actually much more successful then the majority of people who graduated when I should have. I think the level of education needs to be improved in high schools across the nation including CCDHS. I remember sitting as a freshman in business class watching the instructor "teach" us on how to write a check. Is that really what our tax dollars are going towards. Anyone who can read should be able to figure out how to write a check.
It's easy to point the finger and say that people who drop out are losers, but what makes the people pointing the finger so great? What are you doing with your life?? Just asking.

It's a sad fact our educational system doesn't work for all students. Alternative schools are a great way to accomodate students who need more motivation and attention than they would receive in a regular school. It's unfortunate that dropping out seems, to some, to be their only option. In a small town such as Miles City it might be. Doing so doesn't make them losers. But dropping out should not be the end of the line when it comes to their education. Sometimes college, community or otherwise, is a better fit for them. So get your GED and keep learning!

The military offers free schooling to those who want to get thier GED. And a job when you graduate

It's easy to point the finger and say that people who drop out are losers, but what makes the people pointing the finger so great? What are you doing with your life?? Just asking.

I think the barmaids at Lucky Lil's casino would describe me as quite successful, thank you very much. I am known throughout the Town Pump casino chain in Montana as a generous tipper.

Michael Dell -- founder of Dell Computers -- tried to drop out of Memorial High School in Spring Branch Independent School District near Houston TX several times. He finally went on to college but did not finish -- but look where he is now.

I know lots of others for whom the education system no longer works, yet I am math coordinator for a public school system. Maybe I see them because I am in that position and recognize that we are failing to prepare many students for life after high school.

Apparently Michael Dell was prepared for life just fine. But these kinds of stories must be looked at in context. These people succeeded not because of their lack of high school degree but in spite of it. In general, dropping out of high school does not bode well for your future earning potential which in turn affects your progeny's future and their progeny's future. If you drop out, get your GED and take a college class or two. You might be surprised.

There are always exceptions, but your statistical chances of surviving well without an education are very poor.

It sometimes reminds me, this debate, of what I also hear from musicians (or even artists).

Some musicians are naturally talented and they do quite well for themselves while never having a lesson or learning to read music. They go on to great and fulfilling careers.

However, some of them, if presented with an opportunity to expand their horizons and play in a studio session or structured band - they're lost. Reading the changes to the music, learning their assigned part, making notes of changes - it's all a foreign skill. They don't always have the crutch of listening to and mimicking the part by ear. They have to read the part as it is written and then play it for the first time themselves.

Some musicians will talk about not having had formal lessons like it's a badge of honor - that somehow theirs was a special creativity that shined through which would have been suffocated if they'd learned to read music and took lessons. They convince themselves they're actually better off *because* they never had formal lessons.

However, I think, more often than not, it's secretly a pre-emptive defensive attitude designed to cover up the fact they can't read or write music and have to avoid the opportunities they could have if only they knew how.

Sure, there's some brilliant natural talents out there and everyone can point out the few exceptions to the rule. However, adding to your knowledge and talent rarely hurts chances but often opens more doors. One just has to confront the fear that gets worse year after year falling behind brings with it.

I think sometimes labeling one's self as the exception that, in the end, makes one a solo outcast.

Learning variables aside, learning HOW to learn is still important and I think it's often the first thing to suffer in any "dropout" type of situation.

/2 pennies/

[This message has been edited by Dan Mowry (11/18/2009)]

I was a high school drop out but not for reason the same as all the others. I had back surgery when I was 15. 6, 7 ,8 hour days in a class room and lugging around a 30lb backpack wasn't going to cut it for me. I got my whole sofmore year behind. But the school accomidated me and I was able to graduate a year early.

When I was in alternative school I was given 3 subjects at a time that had to be completed within a specific amount of time. It was all self-study, the teacher was just there so keep everyone from running wild. But I was also in the program the very first years it started.

Alternative school is not just for the lazy stoner types, it has done some good. I never would've been able to catch up if it weren't for the program.

Ty Head, i coulda swore u were in alternative school

Wow, that is something to be really proud of.... Maybe you will be invited to the high school as a motivational speaker.