On Monday October 19, 2009 President Obama's Attorney General, Eric Holder issued a new memorandum on medical marijuana, for the select states which allow its medical use, to alleviate a wide range of medical issues such as pain, and eating disorders, along with some mental issues such as PTSD. This is the most substantial shift in marijuana policy since the early 1970's. Attached is a link to the Department of Justices archive. There you may read the memorandum for yourself.
http://blogs.usdoj.gov/blog/archives/192

http://blogs.usdoj.gov/blog/archives/192

I think this is fine.

I'm not so sure Wendy unless there's willing enforcement of the laws.

I watched this special:



http://www.youtube.com/wa...Uqdresdawg

And while there are people who certainly need medical marijuana (which I support) there's a definite dark side to it.

Yes, I agree that there are always issues with law enforcement but I think that if a State decides that medical marijuana is ok then the Feds should bud out. Aren't you a big States' rights guy?

Kyle:

The dark side would be removed if Marijuana was legal (and regulated) for everyone. It is the drug war that is generating the conditions shown in your clip.

Kelly wrote:

The dark side would be removed if Marijuana was legal (and regulated) for everyone.

Kelly, there is a LOT more to it than just a question of legality.

Legalizing marijuana could be considered a good plan for those who need it. The reasoning behind certain persons getting a presciption for totally unnessecary reasons is the problem that needs to be looked at. There is a doctor in baker, that for a mere $150 is handing out prescriptions to just any old joe that walks in off the street. where are the guidelines to who should recieve the presciption, and who is checking up on these doctors that are liberally passing them out.

Amber, if you know first hand about this Baker doctor then you should report him to the police and the licensing board. He should lose his license.

Legalize and tax it already. I can go down to the corner store and pick up a case of beer and a carton of cigs. Both of which are more dangerous and cause more deaths than some weed. (Deaths from marijuana ZERO, and it is impossible to overdose on). Why should law abiding, tax paying citizens have to face jail time and fines up the yahoo for smoking a little grass? For god sakes there is an acive ingredient in marijuana that counteract cancer cells, but preserve normal cells. Dont even get me started on how many hundreds of uses hemp has.

In 2008 49.8 percent (half) of the 1,702,537 total arrests for drug abuse violations were for marijuana -- a total of 847,863. Of those, 754,224 people were arrested for marijuana possession alone. It cost the state an average of $25,000 to house a prisoner for 1 year, You do the math.

If you're interested Google Harry J Anslinger and William Hearst and read for yourself. You will see that prohibition of marijuana is filled with greed, racism, protection of profits, and yellow journalism.

While it is true that Alcohol and Tobacco cause more deaths than marijuana every year, that does not mean it is safe. ANY DRUG ruins your brain. It completely messes up the Dopamine, and eventually you'll need marijuana to feel any emotion. It is VERY psychologically addictive, and people do die from indirect causes. It slows your reaction times, just like alcohol. It lowers judgement. Marijuana, just like any drug, is BAD. It has no "cancer fighting" active ingredient. They give it to cancer patients to help the nausea and to help them have an appetite. Become more well informed about the subject before you go ranting off. Out of all the drugs out there, I agree marijuana is the least harmful, but again ITS A DRUG. It will give you cancer just like a cigarette. Why do people feel the need to have it at all? I'm all for medical marijuana, but I like the pill form of THC. It's better!

Doctors are wacky, I grew up in California. For 50 dollars, you could go to a "clinic" on Santa Monica Beachfront and you just mark a problem, and they give you a presciption. Those places need to go.

Drugs ruin lives, period. Why would you even want to smoke weed? To sit and vegetate and eat? Really, we have enough harmful substances legal here, let's not add another one.

Seriously?

We live in a country overrun with obesity, why would you want to fill the system with a drug that makes you eat alot and sit on your butt?

The use of mary jane breaks down your dna, so if you have kids they could come out abnormal. This isnt just about the females. Males pass their dna down the line as well.

So i guess if your like a 60 year old person who suffers from extreme diabities and can't seem to get into the right state of mind to get healthy, sure its a great idea. Other than that it is just encourages our youth to destroy what remains of what makes our country great.

Marijuana is not addictive. It is habituating. There is a difference.

It is psychologically addictive. Which can be worse than physically addictive.

i'm all for the legalization of marijuana. let adults choose to use it, just as we do with alcohol and cigarettes. god forbid our broke @ss country get some money flowing, create some new industry and have a positive change in the rate of arrests due to holding.

Keep watching Reefer Madness guys. Way to generalize ALL marijuana smokers. 100% of them sit around and watch tv...right. It's ironic that you tell me to be more well informed when it is you that is ill informed. Keep on drinking that government koolaid. Everything that you posted is a lie, and twisted to fit YOUR beliefs. Prohibition didnt work with Alcohol, it's not going to work with weed.

I dont even know where to begin with your your posts. Caffeine is a drug, lets outlaw coffee and soda. It has a drug in it. Aspirin is a drug. Why dont we outlaw McDonalds and Burger King. Because hey, it causes obesity which leads to health problems and death. Driving isn't safe, you can get into a car wreck, lets outlaw that too. Heck walking down the street is dangerous, you can get hit by a car. Breathing in *any* smoke causes DNA damage. There are other ways to consume cannabis you know. Eating and vaporizing for example. Lighting an ordinary paraffin candle can release asthma and cancer causing agents in the air.

You like Marinol, but want regular marijuana to remain illegal? You must hold some stock in Big Pharma. Marinol does not take effect right away, and the patient cant control how much they want to take. If it was so effective, why do people who use marijuana for medical purposes, still smoke, eat or vaporize it. It is also very expensive compared to the latter.

http://www.forbes.com/fee...okers.html

http://www.webmd.com/canc...ain-cancer

http://www.associatedcont...na_is.html

http://www.norml.org/inde...up_ID=6891

http://www.drugpolicy.org...actsmyths/

That is just a MINUSCULE amount of information available.

I dont know why some of the links didnt work. copy and paste the last one (www.drugpolicy.org/marijuana/factsmyths/)and it DEBUNKS all of the claims some have made here.

Marijuana breaks down DNA?!?!?! What are you guys smoking? Wait, you watched those silly anti-drug movies back in the 60's, didn't you? Two headed babies caused by weed. Even in sixth grade, I knew panic driven propaganda when I saw it.

If you are against marijuana, you need to be against tobacco and alcohol, which are more addictive and infinitely more dangerous, first. Get rid of those killers and then talk to me about the evils of weed.

And, for the record, I have never smoked the stuff, just don't care that other folks do.

Marijuana was first outlawed as a dangerous drug in the 1930's because the cotton farmers in the South didn't want hemp grown in the North and competing against their product. The whole evil Dope aspect was part of that publicity campaign. (And, again, I READ that many years ago so can't post a link. I'm sure someone else can find it.)

It's really funny that you say I'm not informed. MANY MANY people in my life have some serious issues due to MARIJUANA. You go on a rant again. Don't tell me I'm listening to the government, read any report about it, read a medical journal, read a case study, conduct a scientific experiment. I'm very well educated and I don't appreciate people advocating the use of an illegal drug. Drugs ruin society. Illegalizing alcohol helped caused mafias, just like the medical marijuana is ruining towns. Watch that video. If you are going to legalize marijuana, legalize cocaine, heroin, opium, acid, meth, and anything else. If you think legalizing marijuana for everyone will help, try legalizing that too. Marijuana is the gateway drug, and once everyone is addicted to weed psychologically, they'll be pushing for the rest to be legal.

http://www.drugwarrant.co...a-illegal/

There you go Amorette

Stephan. Are you living in 1930?. I say your not informed...well...because you aren't informed, no matter how much you try to say you are. Do you even look at what you are posting. You said making alcohol illegal created mafias. Same goes for pot too buddy. It's a two way street. Again, whats happening in that town is because of the legality of marijuana. How many beer company's advertise their product on tv hundreds of times a day?. Do you have a problem with that. If not, then you are a hypocrite.

Medical marijuana ruining towns? I was just in Denver and saw multiple medical marijuana dispensaries, and believe it or not there wasn't any people screaming in the street, looting, riots, stoned driving etc. Last time i checked AK, CA, CO, HI, ME, MI, MT, NV, NM, OR, RI, VT, and WA (where medical marijuana is legal) were all fine and dandy.

Pop and milk are the real gateway drugs if you want to go down that road. The gateway theory is a bunch of bull though So it dosent matter. Stop telling people what they should or shouldn't be allowed to do with THEIR bodies, and by supporting prohibition, you are doing just that.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

Wow, ok. Yup I drink milk everyday so I will probably grow up to be a drug addict.

It strikes me as funny that there are people out there who really don't understand the concept of a simple term "a drug is a drug is a drug"

I don't want someone behind the wheel who is under the influence of a mind altering chemical.

Technically yes, soda, more specifically caffeine is a stimulant, just like nicotine, meth, and several others.

Marijuana is a depressant and a mild hallucinogen. Beer is a depressant. As are other things.

Someone driving around with alcohol in their system or tripping on shrooms in probably going to injure someone, why would pot be any different.

If there is no problem with pot, if it is not addictive in the slightest, why is a multi billion dollar illegal business circle?

I'm not supporting prohibition of pot, I think medical marijuana is fine, I'm against the total legalization of it.
people will have different views on this topic and I doubt anyone will change anyone else's mind about it.

[This message has been edited by stephen (10/26/2009)]

If there is no problem with pot, if it is not addictive in the slightest, why is a multi billion dollar illegal business circle?

This doesn't make any sense. Are you stoned again, Private Matzick?

Nathan Jessup wrote:

Pop and milk are the real gateway drugs if you want to go down that road.

Well that just made me laugh. Nathan, put down the bong for a moment and explain to me how in the hell milk is a "Gateway Drug".

Also Kelly about this :

Marijuana is not addictive

As somebody who's been in rehab I can state quite clearly that marijuana very much IS addictive.

[This message has been edited by Kyle L. Varnell (10/26/2009)]

You went to rehab because you were addicted to smoking weed, Kyle?

This explains a lot.


(1990.....Kyle is sitting on his mother's couch and exclaims, "Well, load me up a thinker! Saved by the Bell is on!")

Read some of the links. It is not physically addictive. Nor is it a depressant. And withdraw symptoms range from mild to nothing at all. Why do they perscribe it for depression and anxiety then??? It is to a degree psychologically addictive, but then again so are video games and about a bazillion other things. Coffee, shopping, sex, surfing the internet, working out, eating. I could go on for a while. It depends on the users personality. You have an addictive personality, you get addicted to things drugs or not.


Kyle and Stephen. Milk isn't a gateway drug, nothing is a gateway drug..Did i say that drinking milk will cause you to become a drug addict. No. Because it wont. The gateway drug is a MYTH. I'll say it slowly.......MYTH. IT DOESN'T EXIST. There is no such thing as a gateway drug. I'm sorry if you couldn't see that my previous post about milk being a gateway drug was intended to be sarcasm. And Kyle, Ill put my bong down, as soon as you put your beer down. See i can do that too.

If it were legalized and regulated, it would have the same restrictions as alcohol. How many people are driving around in a prescription med haze? How many people drive after a few beers, but are still under the legal limit, they are to a degree impaired. Talking on a cell phone eating, all take away from your concentration on the road. If you bothered to look or even research you would know there is a new device which can tell an officer how many hours it has been since a person consumed cannabis.

Stephen, Why don't you get back to slandering your family over the internet on a public forum, and accusing people of selling drugs. That seems to be what your best at.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

Ok, well when you decide to get stoned and drive, I will be sure to write you in prison.

I get stoned and drive, about as often as I drink and drive, Which at my last count was at LEAST once everyday. If I could drive around all the time intoxicated I would. I just cant wait to light up that J and get out on the road.

It's called personal responsibility Stephen. No responsible person should drive a motor vehicle intoxicated on anything legal or not. Using your logic, everyone that drinks, goes out and gets behind the wheel. You were a douche in high school, and it looks like are continuing that fine tradition.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

Kyle, getting ready to watch another episode of "Saved by the Bell":

Actually Gunnar & David what I went to rehab for was something far more serious and is quite frankly nothing to joke about.

Why don't you go back to hitting the bong Nathan? In my book, if you do illegal drugs, YOU ARE THE SCUM OF THE EARTH. That's my persoal opinion. It holds true with my mother, and my brother-in-law, and my old best friend. My friend started smoking weed, eventually she became addicted to meth, cocaine, and alcohol. My mother, smoked weed for medicinal purposes (anxiety for the record) now she has done meth many times, and I feel like only she can help herself. Brother-in-Law, just smokes weed every now and then... STEALS from his own mother to buy weed, and can't even get off the couch to find a job. My sister's boyfriend, started with weed, now is a cocaine dealer. Want me to list more from my own personal experiene??? I smoked weed in high school, ended up addicted to cocaine. I have been clean and sober for 3 years. Of course marijuana is just an innocent bystander right??? NOT A GATEWAY AT ALL? Just wait till you have children, and they don't even want to go play because they are so high. Is that acceptable? Alcohol isn't very well regulated, I see kids all the time getting MIPs. So Really, I'm sure with marijuana its all ok. The point that was to be made is that America doesn't need one more drug to be legal. If you want to smoke that mary jane, MOVE TO AMSTERDAM! I'm sure that city is doing well with all the drugs!
And for the record NATHAN- you are taking this a little to personally, I mean you're acting like you make your income from it or something, and that anything bad against it would harm your business. Chillax dude. My husband might of been a "douche" in high school, but really now? Do we have to start slandering each other? Tell us, do you attend college? Do you take care of your child by working a crappy job while you put yourself through school?? I guess I'm bias, because I love him soooooo muuccchhh <3333
(sorry for the mushy crap.)

[This message has been edited by Smiley (10/26/2009)]

[This message has been edited by Smiley (10/26/2009)]

I'm curious. Did you drink beer? Smoke a cigarette? Then how do you know that beer and cigarettes aren't "gateway" drugs.

Some people are addictive. They will be addictive whether the drug is legal or not. Some people can consume alcohol in moderation and some people wrack up 10 DUIs because they are addicts. However, banning alcohol because a few people have a problem with it didn't stop alcoholism.

Some people can consume chemicals responsibly. They should be allowed to. Some people can't. They need MEDICAL assistance rather than prison.

If you ban all addictive substances, you will not stop addiction. It is a matter of brain chemistry and exists in some people and has since there were people to be addicted.

And banning a medically useful substance by pretending it is as dangerous as heroin because of cotton growers is just plain stupid.

Amorette Allison wrote:

And banning a medically useful substance by pretending it is as dangerous as heroin because of cotton growers is just plain stupid

Not as dangerous Amorette? I wonder if these people would agree with you.

Report says human error probably caused fatal train crash
http://www.boston.com/new...ain_crash/

They also said that the track engineer who died tested positive for marijuana.

Can Marijuana Use Cause Suicide?
http://www.associatedcont...icide.html

You can test positive for Marijuana up to 30 days from the last time you smoked it. Testing positive doesn't prove causality.

Kyle L. Varnell said:

As somebody who's been in rehab I can state quite clearly that marijuana very much IS addictive.

- then -

Actually Gunnar & David what I went to rehab for was something far more serious and is quite frankly nothing to joke about.

Confused David? I never said that I went into rehab FOR marijuana.

Smiley wrote:

MOVE TO AMSTERDAM! I'm sure that city is doing well with all the drugs!

actually it is doing well...

http://www.ukcia.org/rese...stics.html

http://drugwarfacts.org/cms/?q=node/67

[This message has been edited by Kelly (10/26/2009)]

But people that do LEGAL drugs are fine and not the scum of the earth. I see where your coming from now

Let's look at this quote from your hubby. From the smoking thread.

"Drinking in moderation can be good for you, particularly wine."

You and your husband are hypocrites. End of.

I really don't care about you or your family. Sorry. I have my own things and problems to deal with, stop looking for sympathy. You want sympathy look in the dictionary between s#%t and syphilis. I go to school and support a child boo hoo. Cry me a river. You must be the ONLY one in the world to do that. Your family sounds like they have problems. And you blame it all on the weed, because hey, it's not THEIR fault. It's your excuse. The bag of weed went out on the town, brought back some meth, and forced them to smoke it. God forbid they have some PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. It was that devils weed right. The WEED made them steal, do cocaine, and meth. Did they drink and smoke..probably, but those are legal so it's ok. Bull.

I know plenty of successful people that smoke marijuana, and lead normal happy productive life's.

Yes I go to college, and no i don't have any kids. I support myself. What does that matter. Are you a better person because you have a kid? When I do have kids, im not going to feed them some scare tactics and lies about something.

If i was a weed dealer, why would I want it legalized? They make huge profits from it being illegal. It's personal to me because im sick of the lies that you and others make up to keep marijuana illegal, a substance that is less harmful than the 2 legal one that are available today. That is is the definition of hypocrisy.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

How many Americans die every year from prescription drug, or alcohol overdoes, well I can tell you it is much greater than the amount of people who die each year from marijuana overdoes. This is because it is physically impossible to overdoes on marijuana. How often does alcohol end up in the hands of minors?, all the time. How easy is it to walk into a doctors office and complain of pain and immediately they will bring you a bottle of pain pills, that are 10 x more dangerous than marijuana, and can easily become dependent on them. There are problems right here that have needed to be addressed, but have they? My point is that nothing is ever perfect, alcohol is always some how going to end up in the hands of minor, people are always going to be abusing doctors to get what they want. That video clip, is from the media. How often does the media show the good side of things, very rarely, because nobody wants to watch the good news. There is always going to be that 10% of people that abuse these type of things, and we can't base all our judgments on this 10 %. Ask any "honest" officer of the law, if he would rather arrest,an individual who is only under the influence of marijuana or, an individual who is only under the influence of alcohol. More than likely if they are honest, they will say an individual under the influence of just marijuana. Why is this you ask? Well, we all know how people are like when they get intoxicated (not everyone), they act like 3 year old children, and they lose all of their judgment capabilities. Marijuana has never been a "Gateway Drug", it solely depends on the person in question, some people have better self control than other, in just the same way an alcoholic can't stop drinking, because they lack the self control to stop. I just strongly urge people to look at the facts, the true facts, and don't let the stigma, that years of government propaganda has put on marijuana in general skew your opinion on this sensitive subject. This is medicine in its simplest form for those who need it. And please people show me these scientific studies that state that marijuana use will break down your DNA, that is a straight up farce, if i am wrong please show me the scientific paper written on this subject, I would like to read it. Yes some specific strains of marijuana do make you hungry, wow what a bad thing for all those people out their suffering through chemotherapy, or some other toxic form of cancer treatment, in which you lose quite a bit of your appetite, god forbid they lead a quality of life that is close to normal. Ahhhh forget about it they are drug user, their quality of life doesn't mean anything.

[This message has been edited by est (10/26/2009)]

I'm done with these posts. MY opinion is right to me, and yours is right to you. Please Nathan, read up on it some more. Don't sink to the depths of personal slander to get your opinion through, it won't work. Just like someone telling me i'm going to burn in hell for what I believe, you are making a mockery of this post by posting any attack you can find. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, so there is no sense in fighting it. Good luck legalizing marijuana for anyone, I hope that day never comes. Its been nice having a discussion, but Nathan had to get so defensive. Sad day when the boards are ridden with childish HOORAH.



[This message has been edited by Smiley (10/26/2009)]

Wow, what a thread.

Nathan: Not to be the grammar police, but if you're going to college, you're going to need to know the difference between "life's" and "lives".

Not sure what else to say. Alcohol and tobacco, like any substance, even H20, will flat out kill you when abused.

IMO, pot is pretty low on the list ... it was a creation of God after all (right?) and should perhaps just be legalized, and taxed, and get it over with ... and I'm not a pot smoker. Not to say I haven't partaken in the past, but it's just not my thing.

Oh, one more thing Nathan. It's Milescity.com, not the senate. What is said on here will not effect any government's decision. So anything you portray as a "lie" doesn't matter. Take from it what you will. When I decide I have nothing better to do in life, maybe I'll join an anti-drug campaign on senate. Right now I have a lot more important things to do.

I'm just a little saddened to learn that the pagan rituals I was promised will be comprised of neither fertility rituals nor peyote.

Who knew there were such a thing as Episcipagans?

It is the 2nd rule of a witch to not do illegal drugs or sometimes even legal drugs. They damage the body, and an altered state of consciousness interferes with a connection to nature. But I guess for some, bridger, many psychoactive drugs could make people try to fertilize the trees in a CRAZY ritual.

Just legalize it and get it over with that is what I say also. I am not a pot smoker and with any drugs it has it pros and cons. Alcohol has caused more deaths than the ole mary jane. Tax it, tax it and the Feds will get their money back.

Smiley wrote:

It is the 2nd rule of a witch

Which sourcebook are you pulling this witch prestige class from?

Before today I didn't know the difference between lives and life's. It must be that marijuana. You learn something new every day. God forbid someone makes a spelling mistake on this forum.

This isn't the Senate? I'll be darned. I thought I was personally talking to some senators. What I say on here wont affect anything. SAY IT ISN'T SO.

I though a forum is where you share ideas and opinions with one another, And last time I checked this was a forum. I was just letting people know some scientific facts and myths of marijuana. You cant have an argument with out the other side. Look for yourself, don't take my word for it. I provided a link that showed why marijuana is illegal. That article isn't an opinion, it is fact.

I've made my point and i'm sick of arguing. If alcohol and tobacco are legal, marijuana should be too.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

Hey, not disagreeing with you Nathan. It's just when I glanced through the thread you were the last message before I replied (others did so faster than me, I got sidetracked, not unusual) and the "life's" thing was stuck in my head and showed up in what my fingers typed.

Yes smoking marijuana in its raw form does have carcinogens, that will cause cancer. If vaporized it will eliminate almost all of the carcinogens (Note: I stated almost all of them). Even if you could remove all of the carcinogens, that won't mean much, our air is full of carcinogens, they are just at such low PPM ( Parts Per Million) that in an average life time it won't affect the body, as badly as direct contact with large amount of carcinogens. The pill form which is called marinol, does have its uses, but again it is man-made synthetic form and can cost up to 10 grand a year. The pill form does have its uses such as the raw smoke-able form has its uses, when smoked its affects can be felt immediately, the pill can take up to 1 hour before you feel its affects. Still it has its place, just as the raw smoke-able form does. There are numerous ways medical marijuana can be introduced into the body. Smoking usually the fastest way to feel the affects, and is good for people whom have nausea, or need to get the affects right away, again this can be done through a vaporizer which rids most of the carcinogens out, because you are only heating up the THC, and not the leaf material. You may also make tinctures out of it, which means you soak the raw form in a alcoholic substance, and let the THC be dissolved into it. You can make tincture at different strengths, and tinctures can be added to any drink in the form of a dropper, or can be applied under the tongue with a dropper. You may also make Butter out of it and cook anything with the butter that has been simmered with marijuana and strained of all chunks and flower\leaf material, this affects the individual as the marinol pill would, and can be made in your own home with no danger and at little cost to the patient. Like I said before each way has its use weather it is raw or pill form. Just because it comes from the Pharm, doesn't mean it is better for you, or is going to work better.
Here is a decent link to some Pro's\ Con's of medical marijuana use, again I cannot vouch for the information as I did not create, and it could be bias in some ways.
http://medicalmarijuana.p...eID=000141

[This message has been edited by est (10/26/2009)]

Good post. If i can make a suggestion? put some spaces and paragraphs...i got lost a couple times.

This is stephen on smileys...again i am to lazy to change. I mean no disrespect to anyone. I personnally think pot should be legalized and taxed, that way the government doesn't just keep putting money into a pit to say.
i was just debating, and i believe that the negative parts of smoking weed should be publised just like smoking and drinking.

Education is key in everything, drug sex, and violence. The more the people know the better off they are. Knowledge is power and power is knowledge. I totally agree with you that there are many bad sides to its use. I also totally agree that we must stop dumping money into a bottomless pit. If you think about it, what is one of the main commodities that gangs try to control in area, The drug trade. If it were legal that would take one less revenue away from the gangs and also one less reason that they will need to fight. Our prohibition has made people like Pablo Escobar rich and powerful. I read an article where a drug trafficker was openly thanking the US for their prohibition, because it has made him a millionaire (if not a billionaire). I have always been very poor with paragraphs, fingers get ahead of the mind sometime.

[This message has been edited by est (10/26/2009)]

Legalize it, and uses the taxes to help pay for health care. Problem solved.

The drug war cost Americans 49 BILLION! dollars a year.

http://www.drugsense.org/wodclock.htm

Marijuana is an estimated $14 billion-a-year industry in California. Thats JUST California.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/26/2009)]

I decided to NEVER USE ANY ILLEGAL DRUGS when I saw the commercial of the guy frying the egg. Very convincing.

Did you know that your brain REALLY looks like that? I hope if something ever fries my brain, they at least use a little salt and pepper. No excuse for brains being bland.

Properly seasoned, brains make a tasty meal.

8 out of 10 zombies agree.

Levi Forman wrote:

Did you know that your brain REALLY looks like that? I hope if something ever fries my brain, they at least use a little salt and pepper. No excuse for brains being bland.

You amaze me. Just about every thing you say puts a smile on my face. Who would have thought that a thread about pot would come down to tasty brains? You sir have all my respect.

Any cook worth his salt knows that brains must be accompanied by bacon.

Mmm ... chilled monkey brains!

You guys can try but Levi wins for originality.

PUFF PUFF GIVE BE HAPPY

Wendy's photo looks like "chicken fried chicken" with gravy and a Kosty's Curiosity Shop fake vomit on top.

David: you are dating yourself.

That first picture shows me a tasty delightful pastry infused with thc budder, about an eighth per culinary delight! About twenty five bucks on the medical marijuana place that delivers all around the state! I vote for fancy thc infused desserts...

I'de also like to add to this conversation by referring to the statement made by the lady who sounds like the town cryer running down the street yelling "The Sky is Falling" in this high shreiky voice.

Damn lady. I want to tell you that i know the doctor in Baker that you are referring to and you are so far off base it's humorous!

Wasn't it something like, any joe blow off the street can walk in there and walk out for a hundred and fifty bucks with a recommendation..listen closely, that Doctor demands a past history of the condition you're getting approved for and that you are trying to get off of prescription pain pills...tell me this is bad, i dare you!

There arent too many country doctors any more are there/? A real country doctor will listen closely to your symptoms and then tell you how you can cure it or at least make it better. A country doctor hears your pain as you speak about it and realizes that besides the normal prescription pad he recommends something that isn't going to upset your stomach any more by eating the lining up.

There are so many reasons for using medical marijuana that the ones listed as qualifying comes no where near what it should be. I bet that some people even think that we sit around and talk about all the things that medical marijuana may help you with and then you try it and see for yourelf.

The doctor of which you refer to is what we call a compassionate doctor~ He excells in his Medical Field and is a licensed and legal Doctor in the State of Montana...and he's also a damned good Montana'nnnnn...

I say take it back lady and apologize. Go to the links that were provided for your proof...bet you didn't read them did you ... until you do shut the . . . . up!

Um, Steve? If you want to ask Levi out on a date, just get it over with already!

http://www.letfreedomgrow...a_list.htm

Those are just some conditions that medical marijuana can help with.

But hey, dosent marijuana cause lung cancer? I guess not.

http://www.washingtonpost...01729.html

Smoking weed turns you into a tub of goo. And we shouldn't allow a drug that makes you fat. Oh wait..never mind

http://www.fiercebiotech....2007-01-31

But..but it's a gateway drug...... Scratch that

http://www.scienceblog.co...12116.html

It is really amazing how many PROVEN medical uses cannabis has. Yet our government maintains is has "no medical properties"? And remains a Schedule 1 drug. But then why is Marinol legal according to the government, they both have the same active ingredient in THC. Am I missing something here I thought it didn't have any medical qualities? Someone needs to make up their mind

Big Pharma along with numerous others are making loads of cash from the prohibition of marijuana.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/28/2009)]

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/28/2009)]

Yes, and not to forget the Government's New Investigational Drug Program, (NID) that distributes marijuana to patients that were in that program before it's discontinuation a few years ago. The University of Missouri still grows marijuana and send these last four patients their 200 grams of medicinal pot every single month. That's over 7 oz's of Medical Marijuana every month! How can they say it has no value and continue supplying medicine to these patients? Hmmmm.

this is a very interesting article on stoned drivers. in posting this, i am not promoting driving while intoxicated!

http://www.cannabisculture.com/articles/1775.html

http://www.cannabiscultur.../1775.html

I work in drug treatment. Read Dr. David Scratchley's site and his take on marijuana--you'll never see it as "just pot" again. He is the creator of the Matthew Talbott drug treatment centers and is cutting edge. You can also listen to his talk show out of Seattle on Sat. mornings at 10-12.

1. Marijuana is probably the MOST psychologically addicting drug there is. Continued recovery is rare. It is as mentally addicting as meth is physically addicting and it is THE most frustrating drug to rehab specialists.

2. Marijuana actually rewires your brain chemicals which is part of the addictive process. Someone who has used meth for 10 years will probably admit to it being a problem. A heavy pot user for 10 years is just as likely to tell you he has no problem.

3. Marijuana use results in huge work absenteeism.

4. Marijuana does cause lung cancer.

5. One fact that people often don't know is that marijuana is indirectly related to many, many teen deaths. Because marijuana can act as an anti-nausea drug, kids/people who drink and use pot at the same time often do not throw up from too much drinking (which can be life saving because if you throw it up it does not get as much into the bloodstream). If you drink to the point of throwing up, but do not throw up due to the pot, your chances of dying are much, much higher. This is the main reason we are seeing so many younger people dying of alcohol poisoning these days.

6. I am ALL for medical marijuana, but I too, feel more research should be put into perfecting the oral capsules rather than having people smoke it.

Gotta take up some points with you polar bear ...

polar bear wrote:

Marijuana is probably the MOST psychologically addicting drug there is.

Cigarettes, tobacco, a/k/a "Nicotine" has to be way worse ... I know because I'm a smoker and it is practically impossible to quit, even though I've tried and succeeded for at least a year at a time.

polar bear wrote:

Someone who has used meth for 10 years will probably admit to it being a problem.

Yeah, because they're dead. Meth is about the most stupid thing to do.

polar bear wrote:

Marijuana use results in huge work absenteeism.

I seriously doubt that.

polar bear wrote:

Marijuana does cause lung cancer.

And so does life.

The rest of it, I'll let others take you up on it.

My facts are correct Mr. Webmaster and yes, marijuana recovery is less likely than smoking recovery for long term.

I stand behind every one of the statements and there is research to back each of those statements.

Work in drug rehab for awhile and you will see that what I say is absolutely inarguable.

Also, "life" is not a causal factor for lung cancer. I think you probably use that one to justify your own cancer sticks.

[This message has been edited by polar bear (10/31/2009)]

polar bear wrote:

Also, "life" is not a causal factor for lung cancer. I think you probably use that one to justify your own cancer sticks.

Emphysema is the vast problem that kills smokers, not lung cancer.

Don't make me google.

Cancer is ALSO caused by smoking. I have lost several people to lung cancer as a direct result of smoking. You honestly don't think your smoking puts you at risk for lung cancer? That level of denial is shocking to me.

We KNOW that secondhand smoke causes lung cancer, such as the case for Dana Reeves, and you can still deny that first hand smoking is a problem? Some studies are now showing third-hand smoking is a disease causal factor. Wake up, man!

[This message has been edited by polar bear (10/31/2009)]

Hey, ask my father (a smoker) who died at age 31 (crushed by a truck), or my grandfather (a smoker who quit) who died at age 77 (from Alzheimer's), or my grandmother (a smoker her entire life) who died at age 86 (from an infection). It's not so simple ... thus my reference to LIFE ... as in "Life Causes Death". There you go, probably been said before, but you can quote me on that one.

Oh, good grief! Just because everyone who gets hit by a train doesn't die of it, does not mean getting hit by a train is not a life threatening event.

I've got better things to do than argue about my beliefs vs yours. The rest of you can fight it out.

You know what, since I hate misinformation stated as fact ... simply sticking the exact phrase "MOST psychologically addicting drug" into Google results with ...

Link #1. http://en.wikipedia.org/w..._addiction

Which, unless I'm missing something, has no mention of marijuana on the page, although, it does have other stuff really bad for you.

Link #3. http://www.tobacco-facts....-addicting

Which has a list, as follows:

- Tobacco (Nicotine)
- Crack Cocaine (Methylbenzoylecgonine)
- Ice/Glass (Smoked Methamphetamine)
- Oxycodone (OxyContin, Perocet, Tylox, Percodan)
- Heroin (Dacetylmorphine)
- Valium (Diazepam)
- Quaalude (Methaqualone)
- Seconal (Secrobarbital)
- Alcohol

Hmmm, Mary Jane is missing from that too.

Point being ... if your first point, the one you stated as fact (in particular, due to your "expertise"), is incorrect, then why should anyone give any credence to anything stated after?

This one is a crackup too:

polar bear wrote:

Marijuana use results in huge work absenteeism.

I wonder how much work absenteeism marijuana causes vs. alcohol?

I once knew a guy who worked in law enforcement in the Washington, D.C. area. This guy saw a lot of common criminals in his time and a lot of them were black. I think this guy became tainted over time and to hear him tell it, all criminals were black and all blacks were criminals.

I once knew a woman who worked in a prison and drug rehab setting her whole life. To hear her tell it...

I agree that alcoholism also causes a lot of absenteeism.

By the way, Wiki doesn't hold a candle to the research journals that have come out in the last few months on this topic. I would go with Dr. David Scratchley and other top experts in the US over your wiki stuff.

Why would Dr. David Scratchley say pot isn't a dangerous drug. He owns multiple drug treatment centers. He makes tons of money off marijuana being illegal. Way to find a non biased source. Thats like asking a Red Sox fan what he thinks of the Yankees. HOORAY for MISINFORMATION. Polar Bear you did not state one "fact".

If you do some research you will see that in most misdemeanor pot arrests the person is offered rehab instead of a criminal record. Lots of the time, rehab is required no matter what. How many NONVIOLENT POSSESION ONLY marijuana arrest were in the United States in 2008? The answer is 754,224 who were charged with possession only. How much does it cost for even a month of drug rehab? I'm sure it's not cheap. That's a lotta dough for Dr. Scratchley.

I dont blame them. Hmmmmm drug rehab, or lose your financial aid for college, have a criminal record your whole life, be ineligible for low income housing and other government programs. Worse yet you can lose your children. Who wouldn't take that road?

And do I really have to post this link again. Read it please. There are tons of more articles that say the same thing.

http://www.washingtonpost...01729.html

Cigarettes are PROVEN to cause cancer, yet I could smoke a whole field of tobacco legally if I really wanted to. Same with some booze. Even if marijuana does cause lung cancer, why should it be illegal when cigarettes and beer are legal and readily available. They cause cancer too. There are a lot of things that MAY cause cancer. We know the risks, and yet we make a PERSONAL decisions to engage in those risks.

It is frightening how much misinformation there is spread around about cannabis, a drug that is impossible to overdose on.

Prohibition of cannabis HAS killed people. Quite a few of them actually. Thats a FACT

I feel like I'm beating my head against a brick wall. Webmaster you pretty much covered it all. And Howdy, great link to the cannibisculture website. Good stuff

I like the point made about alcohol. How many people go to work hungover every day? Im sure they are really productive and never call in sick

Irvin Rosenfeld, one of the patients that receives medical marijuana from the GOVERNMENT. Yeah the government. Look it up. Is a stock broker who deals with millions of dollars a day. And he smokes a joint when he gets up, when he is going to work, a couple AT work, and a few when he gets home. Sound really unproductive.

I would go with common sense over anything you say Polar Bear. Where are all these journals, tests and experts? That have recently come out

I also like how you say marijuana is indirectly (key word INDIRECTLY) related to teen deaths from binge drinking. Seriously..Wow. Would they have been throwing up if they hadn't over consumed a LEGAL (well not to them) available drug in alcohol? That is laughable. If they had smoked just weed they would of been fine and here today.

With our prohibition laws we are driving people to drink, while a safer, and less dangerous drug (marijuana) is outlawed. You just proved my points with that paragraph on teen deaths from drinking. Remember it's IMPOSSIBLE to overdose on marijuana.

Tell me why should marijuana be illegal, when booze and cigarettes are legal?

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (10/31/2009)]

polar bear wrote:

By the way, Wiki doesn't hold a candle to the research journals that have come out in the last few months on this topic. I would go with Dr. David Scratchley and other top experts in the US over your wiki stuff.

What's funny is, add PhD to the end of your name and suddenly you're smart. David Scratchy, Scratchety, whatever ... is about as smart as Sarah Palin ... they both have books with promising bunches of money.

Let's see, in a Google Fight:

- "Sarah Palin Research Journals" -> 455,000 results

- "David Scratchley Research Journals" -> 1,230 results

Heck, let's try:

- "Larry Antram Research Journals" -> 1,230 results

So the win goes to Sarah, apparently, the smarter of the two, or at least I'm as smart as Mr. Scratchy, but without a book or the itch.

According to MY research, it's Itchy who's the doctor. I don't have a PhD, so if you don't believe me, here's some visual evidence:



For those of you who don't know, Itchy is the mouse (you can tell by, um ... the physician's attire he's wearing).

[This message has been edited by Brian A. Reed (10/31/2009)]

Brian A. Reed wrote:

Um, Steve? If you want to ask Levi out on a date, just get it over with already!

It probably wouldn't go anywhere anyway since you bought up all the KY in the area.

touche'

[This message has been edited by Steve Sullivan (11/1/2009)]

Sorry to come back again, but the other night, I was watching Silent Hill. I had to screen shoot this, because I found it interesting.

So Silent Hill shows me what side he's going to be on no matter what.
Nathan, why are you acting like its the biggest issue of the century, and if you don't go around spouting off about how it is safe, the world will end?
I'm starting to get a little disgusted with your posts. If any child or teenager read some of the things you posted, they would think it was safe. Who cares whether it is or isn't, kids who normally are scared to do drugs might be tempted to try it! It's not cool to drink, smoke, or do drugs! I think many parents will agree that teaching your kid early on in life about the dangers of drugs&alcohol, they will remember and be less likely to abuse.

You keep saying it isn't a gateway drug, but I don't know if you have ever been on a drug deal. Not always the safest things. DO you really think legalizing marijuana for recreational use would reduce crime over it?

You compare cigarettes to marijuana. Marijuana is "safer" for your body.
.... scenario, who would you rather work with?? A person who needs a cigarette after a really busy time, or a person who comes to work stoned, can't function, can't really think fast, eyes are red and glazy? If marijuana was legal, that's how it would be. Think about it from a different perspective. Could you really handle that?

I am all for the decriminalization of marijuana.
I work in addiciton counseling and I have never heard of Scratchley.
I apologize for the video but I couldn't help myself.

Apology accepted, we can't see it anyway

I'm a little miffed that Wendy hasn't corrected the flaming error in the title to this thread~and she was the 3rd poster!

http://www.drugpolicy.org...actsmyths/

Debunks a lot of myths of marijuana with references to peer-reviewed journals.

Marijuana prohibition is a VERY big deal Smiley. Is it the most important issue our goverment has on it's hands? Nope, but to say it is not important is being very ignorant.

How much taxpayers money is used to outlaw it? Is our country not in debt?(40 BILLION a year spent on the failed war on drugs) How many citizens are arrested for having or growing a little weed. How many NONVIOLENT MANDATORY MINIMUM (which means the judge HAS to sentence the person to a certain number of years in prison. While rapists, thieves, pedophiles, and sex offenders are all eligible for parole before them.) prisoners are in prison? What about the Mexican Drug Cartels on the Mexican border whose main cash flow is from marijuana, and all the deaths from prohibition? That's not important to you?

YOU might not think it's a big deal, but for many others it is an VERY important issue. It's an issue about freedom. Why should people that smoke a substance that is less dangerous than cigs and booze be considered criminals and treated as such?

Am i saying marijuana is totally safe. No way, because it's not. I have said through out this entire discussion that marijuana is safer than tobacco and alcohol, and it is. I'm not condoning any drug use by kids. It's ironic you brought kids up because right now they can get pot easier than booze and cigs. Why? because those 2 products are regulated and controlled by the government. Sure kids can get their hands on them, but it's harder. Drug dealers don't check id's. Which is why it should be regulated and be available to people 18+ just like tobacco. The fact is prohibition of cannabis and the results of that prohibition are more harmful than the drug itself. That's why the laws need to change.

Legalizing all drugs WOULD reduce crime and use. Look at Portugal, they decriminalized ALL drugs and saw a drastic drop in use and crime. In the Netherlands, for example, which has the most liberal drug policy in Europe and where marijuana is effectively legal, marijuana use among teens is actually lower than in the United States. A survey found 28% of Dutch teens smoked marijuana as compared with 41% of American teens, and 23% of American teens had experimented with other illicit drugs as compared with only 6% of European teens.

http://mjperry.blogspot.c...al-is.html
http://sensiblecolorado.org/cmi/youth/
http://stopthedrugwar.org...tudy.shtml

Your posts are the ones that are disgusting. They are filled with lies and exaggerations about marijuana simply because you don't like it. I could post PAGES of proven scientific facts and you wouldn't change your mind. And that is fine, You don't have to like pot or support it's use. Im posting because people like you spread misinformation and lies about cannabis to other people who may not be well informed. I hate misinformation.

If someone saw some of your posts, they would think that if they smoked some weed, they would turn into coke dealing, meth abusing, jobless lazy people who won't amount to anything. Your words not mine. And that is just not true and will never be true. It is a SCARE tactic into getting people to believe what you say. That is way more disgusting than anything I wrote.

I personally know a bunch of people that smoke before work. And all of them are successful in college and are model employees. Again it's called PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY. Some people can handle working high, others cant. Just because someone smokes marijuana does not mean they are going to come to work stoned off their ass not capable of doing anything, become a giggling couch potato, or smoke on the job. Do you assume people who drink are wasted all the time and drink at work? Same goes with pot. For lots of people, marijuana helps them focus and get through their day.

"For lots of people, marijuana helps them focus and get through their day."

Why not treat the real problem rather than living your life foggy?

How would you know about living your life foggy?

How about a few facts, to back up your "facts":

polar bear wrote:

1. Marijuana is probably the MOST psychologically addicting drug there is. Continued recovery is rare. It is as mentally addicting as meth is physically addicting and it is THE most frustrating drug to rehab specialists.

Prove it.

polar bear wrote:

2. Marijuana actually rewires your brain chemicals which is part of the addictive process. Someone who has used meth for 10 years will probably admit to it being a problem. A heavy pot user for 10 years is just as likely to tell you he has no problem.

Again, prove the statement, not just part of it, but all of it.

polar bear wrote:

3. Marijuana use results in huge work absenteeism.

Prove it, I'll convert.

polar bear wrote:

4. Marijuana does cause lung cancer.

Prove it.

polar bear wrote:

5. One fact that people often don't know is that marijuana is indirectly related to many, many teen deaths. Because marijuana can act as an anti-nausea drug, kids/people who drink and use pot at the same time often do not throw up from too much drinking (which can be life saving because if you throw it up it does not get as much into the bloodstream). If you drink to the point of throwing up, but do not throw up due to the pot, your chances of dying are much, much higher. This is the main reason we are seeing so many younger people dying of alcohol poisoning these days.

Again prove it.

polar bear wrote:

6. I am ALL for medical marijuana, but I too, feel more research should be put into perfecting the oral capsules rather than having people smoke it.

And after all of that, you're ALL for it? Seriously?

You also stated above, exactly this:

polar bear wrote:

My facts are correct Mr. Webmaster and [...] I stand behind every one of the statements and there is research to back each of those statements.

Prove each of the statements then. You gave a very specific six and claim to have the research, so provide it, not so hard, right? Also since you're in the industry, convincingly, perhaps you can change a lot of people's minds for the better -- including my own. There's your chance to make the world a better place.

If it helps them, then why do you care if they are "living in a fog "

And how do we treat their "real" problem Polar Bear. Should we just throw a bunch of prescription drugs at them? Should we enroll them at your savior Scratchey's clinics. Please enlighten us all, You must be the only one with the answer. If it were really that simple to "treat the real problem" no one would have any kind of disorder.

http://www.drugpolicy.org...actsmyths/

That has to be the 4th or 5th time that link has been posted.

Polar Bear can't back up his "facts" because they are not facts.

I also find it ironic that the people that are for the legalization or decriminalization of marijuana have provided NUMEROUS links and sources, While the anti pot brigade has produced a big fat 0

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/1/2009)]

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/1/2009)]

Ok, well mariijuana is illegal right now. Since it is illegal, those people who you talk about that are "just fine" going to work after smoking weed really aren't. They are violating the rules of their company, and they are also breaking the laws of our city, county, state, and country. Tell me again they are OK? That's a lot of lawbreaking going on. I don't care about why marijuana is illegal, what is really important is that you stop drawing facts off bias websites. Pro-marijuana sites will have pro-marijuana facts. Anti-drug websites will have anti-drug facts. Is that not true? From a completely NON-BIAS sort, as well as I think anyone could find on the subject, SOME TRUE FACTS!
This is a complete pull from "Exploring Psychology, 7th edition in modules, David G. Myers" (this book can be purchased from the college) "Marijuana consists of the leaves and flowers of the hemp plant, which for five thousand years has been cultivated for its fiber. Whether smoked or eaten, marijuana's major active ingredient, THC (delta-9-tetahydrocnnabinol), produces a mix of effects that make the drug hard to classify. (Smoking gets the drug into the brain in about 7 seconds, producing a greater effect than does eating the drug, which causes its peak to be reached at a slower, unpredictable rate.) Like alcohol, marijuana relaxes, disinhibits, and may produce a euphoric high. But marijuana is also a mild hallucinogen, amplifying sensitivity to colors, sounds, tastes and smells. And unlike alcohol, which the body eliminates within hours, THC and it's by-products linger in the body for a month or more. Thus, contrary to the usual tolerance phenomenon, regular users may achieve a high with smaller amounts of the drug than occasional users would need to get the same effect.

A user's experience can vary with the situation. If the person feels anxious or depressed, using marijuana may intensify these feelings. And the more one uses it, the greater one's risk of anxiety, depression, or possibly schizophrenia, even after controlling for other drug use and personal traits. (Arseneault and Others, 2002; Patton and Others, 2002; Zammit and Others, 2002). Daily use bodes worse than infrequent use.

The National Academy of Sciences (1982,1999) and National Institute of Drug Abuse (2004) have identified other marijuana consequences. Like alcohol, marijuana impairs the motor coordination, perceptual skills, and reaction time necessary for safely operating an automobile or other machine. "THC causes animals to misjudge events," reports Ronald Siegel (1990) "Pigeons wait too long to respond to buzzers or lights that tell them food is available for brief periods; And rats turn the wrong way in mazes." Marijuana also disrupts memory formation and interferes with immediate recall of information learned only a few minutes before. Such cognitive effects outlast the period of smoking. (Pope and Yurgelun-Todd, 1996; Smith, 1995)

Scientists have shed light on marijuana's cognitive, mood, and motor effects with the discovery of concentrations of THC sensitive receptors in the brain's frontal lobes, limbic system, and motor cortex. (Iverson, 2000) As the 1970's discovery for receptors for morphinebut researchers on the trail for morphine-like neurotransmittors (the endorphins), so the recent discovery of "cannabinoid receptors" has led to a sucessful hunt for naturally occuring THC-like molecules that bind with cannabinoid receptors. These receptors may naturally control pain. If so, this may help explain why marijuana can be therapeutic for those who suffer the pain, nausea, and severe weight-loss associated with AIDS (Watson and others, 2000) Uses such as this have motivated legislation in some states to make the drug legally available for medical purposes. To avoid the toxicity of marijuana smoke-which, like cigarette smoke, can cause cancer, lung damage, and pregnancy complications- The Institute of Medicine recommends medical inhalers to deliver the THC."

Ok, So I have quotes at least 6 un-biased medical studies. Your turn. Dp any of your "pro-drug" websites have references like that???

Actually, in our work we don't try to argue with the marijuana users. They usually don't come to us until they are in trouble with the law or have run over someone. They are always sure they are just fine and everyone else is nuts. They are just "free spirits" and the "establishment" is trying to hold them down. They are full of conspiracy theories too.

They don't want to be convinced because they are--psychologically so addicted that they will defend in the face of ANY facts. They don't want to be confused with the facts, so studies presented really don't make a bit of difference and it would be a waste of time to think otherwise. After their spouses have left with their children, they have lost their jobs, and their cable TV gets cut off (that is hitting bottom for them) then they wander around until they get in trouble with the law. Pot users rarely voluntarily seek treatment.

The biggest sadness I see is kids using pot and alcohol together resulting in alcohol poisoning deaths because they don't throw up due to the pot. I guess I would also have to add the number of truly neglected little children because their parents are potheads.

Blah, blah, blah ... Too long of a message Smiley, (which I'm guilty of as well) ... but lost interest part way through the first paragraph.

I pointed out 6 statements, represented as fact, and simply asked the proof of each, especially since the poster is apparently in the industry ... 6 links to change my mind. 6 links to prove that stated was not false.

No "he said, she said" ... give me proof. If there is some sort of expert, then give me his name (Mr. Scratchy doesn't really apply, as he's a "Good Christian" making lots of bucks off whatever spews) or give me a link to some sort of an educated document ... shouldn't be that hard. 6 links.

Scratchley is the author of many books, articles, runs 6 Matt Talbott Drug Treatment Centers, has his own weekly radio talk show, presents many seminars to professionals, teaches at U of WA, consults for many adolescent units, and has 3 doctorates (pharmacology, psychiatry, and neurology). If you don't count him as a top expert, you will count no one. I give up with you.

You don't want facts, you just want to justify.

You stated six statements as fact, guaranteed facts ... I simply want to know the proof of each.

Here's a template to get you started:

1. [to be completed]
2. [to be completed]
3. [to be completed]
4. [to be completed]
5. [to be completed]
6. [to be completed]

And oh, BTW, some of the most stupid people I've ever met have had PhD appended to their names.

Do you speed in your car, jay walk, not wear your seatbelt? If you do your are also breaking the laws of our country. Actually one of my friends works for a medical marijuana company that allows the use of medical marijuana when on the clock. Get off your mountain.

I've posted MANY links. The Washington post. WebMD, Forbes, Drug Policy Org. medical Marijuana pros cons. Those really sound and look like "pro drug websites" Give me a break. I'm not going to post them again. Look for yourself. In fact NORML has NUMEROUS links and studies on the website, but i didn't use them because it's a PRO POT website and I figured someone would call me out on it. Your reaching for straws now.

http://robertlindsay.word...zophrenia/


There's a new one for ya. It really looks like a pro drug website.

Your studies and links don't really prove anything you said throughout this entire discussion other than that it's a mind altering drug. Which it is, but so is alcohol and tobacco. So they should make those illegal too right

Nice cop out Polar Bear. You cant post any evidence because it dosent exist.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/1/2009)]

No one is saying smoking dope is healthy and you should do it every day. They are just saying that, as far as things that are bad for you go, it is pretty mild stuff, far less dangerous than either alcohol or tobacco, and the federal gov't should stop wasting time, money and effort on dealing with it.

(Oh, and never say having a radio show makes a person an expert on anything except self-promotion. Whenever I hear, oh, so-and-so has a radio show, therefore they must know something, I just laugh.)

[This message has been edited by Amorette Allison (11/1/2009)]

"And oh, BTW, some of the most stupid people I've ever met have had PhD appended to their names."

LOL, I hear this every day from my GED students!

Amorette, you summed it up BEAUTIFULLY.

polar bear wrote:

LOL, I hear this every day from my GED students!

And exactly how many PhD co-workers have you worked with? I've worked with plenty. And BTW, I finished my GED in about 18 minutes ... knowing how many had to be answered correct, and the statistics of the rest ... dot 1, dot 1, dot 1, dot 1, dot 1 ... kind of adds up after a while.

Still no answers though. So you have nothing else to offer?

Junk food has been shown to be as addictive as heroin...

http://www.grist.org/arti...-as-heroin

http://www.sciencenews.or...to_addicts

[This message has been edited by Kelly (11/1/2009)]

No, I deal with circular thinkers all week long. Not doing it on the weekends. Glad you were able to pass the GED.

polar bear wrote:

No, I deal with circular thinkers all week long. Not doing it on the weekends. Glad you were able to pass the GED.

You really are a dumbass. Seriously. You won't provide the proof, because you're speaking out of your ass. While I hate to resort to name calling, something that's not supposed to happen here, you deserve it after the GED comment.

I've been published, Photo District News (I can pull the centerfold article out and scan it if you like), I've been awarded sole "Best Product of the Year" in the Multimedia Category by Ziff-Davis/PC Magazine (another centerfold feature and have a Lucite block to prove it), I was the sole "Primary Developer" of Microsoft Scenes 1.0 (after, which was brought to my attention, BillG specifically stated it was the most profitable product [costs vs sales] in the history of the company -- and I believe that record still holds), and you know what ... my highest level of "officially completed education" was as a sophomore in high school, at CCDHS. I took the PSAT test back then, a year later, scored every question correct in mathematics, and took whatever the test was for the military, and got every single question correct on it. Flat out 100%. (The Navy hounded me to get into their nuclear program after).

Glad that I was able to pass my GED, your ass.

Do you realize I've done work in the area of Wavelet Mathematics?

"The man who knows all, knows nothing" ... and I don't pretend to be that man ... but you are about as stupid as they come.

I bet you suspect I have my doctorate, don't you

I suspect, you live around Mercer Island, and don't have much of anything in your life. Period.

I have never been to Mercer Island.

And now you are a liar. Good job. At least I don't hide behind "polar bear" -- it's pretty apparent who I am.

I repeat, I have never in my life ever been to Mercer Island. I don't know where you got that information, but it is wrong. I am not a liar.

Do you deny the little WA thing above your posts?

Good lord. Do you think everyone in WA lives in Mercer Island? I do live in WA, but far, far from Mercer Island area. Not even close. About as far away as you can get.

polar bear wrote:

They don't want to be convinced because they are--psychologically so addicted that they will defend in the face of ANY facts. They don't want to be confused with the facts, so studies presented really don't make a bit of difference and it would be a waste of time to think otherwise.......The biggest sadness I see is kids using pot and alcohol together resulting in alcohol poisoning deaths because they don't throw up due to the pot. I guess I would also have to add the number of truly neglected little children because their parents are potheads

We are still waiting for you to enlighten us with some of your "facts" Where are they? How hard would it be to post just one of them? Is it because....... they don't exist? I think so. What a shocker

If you are SO concerned for the kids why aren't you warning teens about the dangers of alcohol instead sitting there demonizing weed? "Well they drank to the point of death, but im gonna blame it on the weed" Thats what you are saying and it is a LOAD of crap. Drink too much alcohol= DEATH... Too much weed= sleepy time thats a FACT. Because remember marijuana is IMPOSSIBLE to overdose on.

I'm 99% sure there are more neglected children because of alcohol then weed. Did someone skip you in the smoking circle? Is that why you are convinced that weed is horrible?

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/1/2009)]

You said, "I have never in my life ever been to Mercer Island" ... which all of us in WA know exactly what it is ... simply a stop across I90 towards the floating bridge.

So you're telling me you've never been across the I90? Be careful in your response. I'm a bit wiser than you may realize.

How about you just be honest and tell us your name? Huh? I don't think that's going to happen.

I have never been there. Never seen the floating bridge. Never been there. Not even close! And yes, I have lived in WA for 30 years. Why do you care about my being at Mercer, Island. Is this some sort of mystery clue or something?

Okay, Donna. Let's just say Walla Walla area instead.

My FIL is here. He has lived in WA 81 years. He has never been to Mercer Island either. This is the most ridiculous conversation I ever imagined having with anyone.

If I had been to Mercer Island, you would find me credible? LOL!

Donna, know who you are ...

You have just breached stalking laws. Do you know that?

Hah, so I'm not so stupid ... and yes I know the laws (above which, irrelevent).

Completely unimportant, but I never stated your full name ... so let's just keep it at that.

No, lets not keep it at that. I work for Dept. of Corrections and I have to report anything like this that happens. You have 2 minutes to rectify before I make the call to security.

Call away, if you want my exact address and phone number, e-mail me: it is [email protected]

You get your wish. I have all your contact information.

Check your email for the details of how I will be proceeding.

regarding the polar bear-webmaster fallout:
wow... just wow.

[This message has been edited by Christen LeBlanc Ramsey (11/1/2009)]

Polar, this is Larry's own site, that is hardly stalking...This being a privately owned web site, if you didn't wish to engage him, you had the option to leave...

Own site or not, he does not get to identify my name and location. Add the other details I have posted here and I am now easily found. Over years of working with criminals I am completely aware of how this puts me at risk and his site or not, he has breached the stalking laws concerning the internet. I know--I had to report another person just weeks ago. The paperwork will be horrendous, but this cannot be allowed.

I repeat...You had the option to leave when this first started...Instead you stayed and continued...This is not stalking IMO...You are being overly dramatic IMO...

Plus, if you had to report someone else a while back, it sounds like you love to make this happen, so you can make an issue out of it...Your hands are far from clean IMO...I have been on the net for years and never ever had to report anyone...

[This message has been edited by howdy (11/1/2009)]

I had no indication that my personal information would be published, thereby giving me a chance to protect myself. I simply disagreed with the opinions on marijuana and got attacked, baited, and now put a risk. I am required to report. It is a safety issue and a big one. I am not being overly dramatic. I work with 500 inmates per year.

You doth protest too much. Nobody gives a rats ass who you are or where you live. But, by staying and arguing on Larry's site, you are just as culpable in identifying yourself. Your word usage and tone give it away immediately.

The average corrections person has to make several safety incident reports per year. I had to make 2 in the last month alone, not involving the internet. I have had to make 5 over the past few years involving the internet. It is part of my job to make sure these things are documented.

If I even "feel" threatened in any way, I have to report. This was a blatant publishing of name and location which puts me at risk.

you stated yourself, based upon your other details YOU added you could be easily found. sorry, polar bear, if your name is really donna, you are one of many donna's living in washington state and probably working for the department of corrections too, as YOU informed us. all the same... you are being quite dramatic.

Let's just let this play out now, folks. It is out of my hands at this point. Everyone go back to what you are doing. The train wreck (the part you will see) is over now. Rest will be handled behind closed doors. Notifications are in progress.

At yet here you STILL are...idiot. If you are so concerned about your safety, why the FUDGE are you still posting. You should have "gone dark" as soon as this started, but NO...you gotta have the last word. Not much more intelligent than the criminals you work with. Self righteous I might add.

[This message has been edited by Kelly (11/1/2009)]

My details were not enough. A webmaster posting a location along with a name should know MUCH better than that. He should know the laws.

My being here now doesn't put me at any more risk. The damage is done. I am not the one who needs to be worried at this point---believe me.

I cannot believe that Larry is kind enough to still allow you to post...He is a nicer person than I am, for sure!!!

Well if you backed up your facts polar bear none of this would of happened.

This thread is awesome.

My being here now doesn't put me at any more risk. The damage is done. I am not the one who needs to be worried at this point---believe me.

If you were truely afraid for your safety, you would realize that you are instigating, which does indeed put you at more risk, from those supposed boogy men who are out to get you. After all, isn't that how the criminals you work with think? Get real.

Just smoke a bowl of mary jane. she'll calm you down.

[This message has been edited by Kelly (11/1/2009)]

Kind?

I disagreed with him so he posted name and location. Do you not get that is where the stupidity arises?

The only stupid thing I have seen tonight is YOU....Larry has always been very kind to not only create this web site but to give of his time to run it...You deliberately started an argument with him when you could not give him the facts to back up your claims...Whoever is suppose to "investigate" this stalking, should be very angry with you for giving them this extra work...It never would have happened without your instigating...

He posted a "Donna" somewhere in washington. That is hardly pinpoint accuracy for Google maps. You provided the more revealing information yourself...again I say, "idiot."

Whoever is suppose to "investigate" this stalking, should be very angry with you for giving them this extra work.

PRECISELY!

[This message has been edited by Kelly (11/1/2009)]

He posted my town. My small town. Where I am in a very specific line of work.

And who was the idiot who posted which line of work? DUH?

I work in drug treatment.

[This message has been edited by Kelly (11/1/2009)]

Doesn't matter. It is the location and name which break the law.

It probably wouldn't go anywhere anyway since you bought up all the KY in the area.

touche'

Damn straight I did. Your mother is all dried up. And you misspelled "douche."

Just remember, Steve, you brought this on yourself.

OH for God's sake, you sound ridiculous...(message was aimed toward polar)

[This message has been edited by howdy (11/1/2009)]

He posted my town. My small town. Where I am in a very specific line of work.

Doesn't matter. It is the location and name which break the law.

Which is it? So your line of work didn't id you then? Donna, the fact that you are arguing this still also further helps to id you to any mc.com'r that read your posts when you lived in Miles City. People have styles of posting and you are holding true to yours.

Dexter is on...have a good night all.

Many things are addictive ... if you're weak-willed enough to become addicted to them.

Polar Bear, you're going to get a bit of a surprise when I start a new thread ... Like I said, I'm not as stupid as you think. I'm still waiting for the sheriff or his deputies to show up.

Amen Brian....

You are waiting for the wrong people and as I told you, this will take weeks. Paperwork, you know!

And, no, I won't be a bit surprised.

[This message has been edited by polar bear (11/1/2009)]

Addiction is a disease, not a weak will.

Author: polar bear Posted: 11/1/2009 5:32:29 PM From: - WA
My being here now doesn't put me at any more risk. The damage is done. I am not the one who needs to be worried at this point---believe me.


Webmaster, that certainly sounds like a threat. And that I believe is what cyberstalking is by definition, making threats.

She is afraid of being identified and stalked, but the help for the stalking will be weeks away because of paperwork? WTF?

Keep chatting polar bear ... the now debunked expert ... entertainment at its finest.

New. Best. Thread. Ever.

Wow! Just crazy!

I am not asking for help for the stalking. I am reporting the broken law.

And I must thank you for leaving it up long enough to be copied and to be seen by those who need the facts.

You now may remove it if you wish.

[This message has been edited by polar bear (11/1/2009)]

"polar bear", imo, has not only threatened me publicly, but privately ...

I'm going to to post all relevent e-mail messages soon. As in very soon.

Author: polar bear Posted: 11/1/2009 6:06:45 PM From: - WA
I am not asking for help for the stalking. I am reporting the broken law.

Polar Bear will you please cite the law. I know I would like to see it because if it happens to me I want to know what the law is. TIA!

Use your head man. I keep trying to give you ways to save face. Ways to show that you are concerned for my safety, as a user of your site.

[This message has been edited by polar bear (11/1/2009)]

Have I banned you or have you been gagged?

Save face?? You have got to be kidding me!!!!

THREAD OF THE YEAR. It's like watching a train wreck.

All I asked is that you remove breach of privacy information that you had access to privately as a webmaster and I specifically asked that you to for my safety due to my line of work. You have refused to do so. I realize you may be embarrassed to do that, but your concern for my safety should come before your need to save face amongst your loyal readers here.

I'm not embarrassed one bit, you should be, as in my opinion, you are a flat out liar ... and got caught in one.

Just this morning I was thinking about posting a message that this site was getting pretty boring. And couldn't someone get a thread like the one in June called nothing. Larry must of read my mind. Bravo,thanks Larry.

You KNOW that I am not lying and exactly what is going on. Keep driving that stake a little deeper. You are giving me all the evidence I need.

Just keep up the antagonistic attitude....Polar, you are your own worst enemy!!

Hmm... guess I was wrong... maybe all of the marijuana emissions are impacting global warming which apparently is threatening the the polar bears more than I thought.

Is this a related thread to the "compromised identity"issue? http://milescity.com/foru...fpid=96242 If you are that threatened, why continue to post? Something smells here.

Richard ... there you go. Good detective work, and required no effort on my behalf. Ms. "Polar Bear" pretty much outted herself before.

what makes me mad, is this stuff makes it even harder for the people that are genuinely being stalked to get help...Ms. Polar Bear cries wolf way too often!!!

I don't cry wolf.

You wish to 'play' on a public street (this site) and we are all responsible for your 'safety' ? BS!!

Ok, your annoying and wrong. You dear lady win the internets in all their glory You personally have given out every piece of information about yourself on this website. If I was your boss and there was a legitimate concern over this type of thing then I'd fire you. For those that don't know how to do a search I'll provide everything she's given up so far of her own free will on this website.

Tim, my name was Donna Kingsley and I graduated in 1974 from CCHS. I did not make it to my reunion this summer. We had a family illness and emergency during that time.

I now live in Walla Walla, WA. I am the head teacher for the Walla Walla Juvenile Justice Center Detention School (kids' jail) and absolutely love it. I just began my 8th year doing that and taught college just before that. We live on a 35 acre farm and my sons are 18 and 21. My husband and I are half owners in a commercial fishing company in AK during the summers. He is also a commercial boat builder, retired from teaching and subs for me, and is a Lt. Fire Captain.

I used the smiley faces to show what you've posted. I would appreciate if you would also report me for some bogus stalking law violation.

Not to mention you can actually use the information she gave to get.....wait for it....her work phone number and email. Wow, human flesh search at its finest.


added: if I'm using that term correctly. I just learned of it.

[This message has been edited by Kelly (11/1/2009)]

K.Duffy said:

I'm a little miffed that Wendy hasn't corrected the flaming error in the title to this thread~and she was the 3rd poster!

Nothing I would have posted could possibly make this thread any better than it is. It's even better than a Jimbo v. Brian rant. Wow.

wOw . . . great thread. I had been passing on reading it as I figured it would just be another argument between those who do and those who don't. Just goes to show you can't judge a book by its cover.

Ok, so while I was out working (un drugged btw) I missed a lot. Polar Bear- Wow.
Webmaster- Haha good job dude.
Nathan Jessup (I've asked around if anyone knew you, and they all said NO, so really you calling my husband a douche was pretty dumb, seeing as no one knew you, and your life is probably an epic fail)
You keep asking for FACTS! WTF more do you want?? Want me to do a double blind study with 1000 people? Want me to do a case study on your fried brain. I'm not trying to spout off "propaganda." As I have previously stated, marijuana is something that does hit home because of EVERY experience in my life with it. Why wouldn't I work against it? Maybe you just don't see the effects of all your "friends" that do it? How many of them work at Taco John's? Really, memory loss BAD, increased chance of psychological disorders BAD. Those ARE FACTS. Alcohol=BAD, Cigarettes=BAD. I have been driving for 3 years, 2 and a half without a license. I'm not saying I'm perfect. I break the law, but when I do, it's not dangerous. It's something like "Driving with a permit without a licensed driver."

Geez, it's not a fact race. Alcohol and Cigarettes are BAD, but legal. We can't do anything about it now. Marijuana=BAD, but illegal. WE CAN keep it that way. Right?? I mean why legalize ONE MORE bad thing? Seriously though, when you realize that your drug usage is a problem, when you can't keep a job or a family, you won't even have a voice to tell people how you feel. You won't be able to remember what you want to say. That's just from marijuana.

Shannon Marie

P.S - http://robertlindsay.wordpress.com/2009/09/16/does-marijuana-cause-schizophrenia/ Does NOT provide any reference to ANY studies. It just vaguely mentions them. Just a note.

[This message has been edited by Smiley (11/1/2009)]

1. http://www.physorg.com/ne...80425.html (Read about the third paragraph. Alcohol is MUCH worse, but marijuana still causes abnormalities in the brain)
2. http://www.guardian.co.uk...nabis-risk
3. http://www.newscientist.c...highs.html
4. http://faculty.washington.../mari.html
5. http://www.sciencedaily.c...123240.htm
6. http://www.nida.nih.gov/M...9-10.html

Credible, Non-Bias, FACTS.

Kinda beyond the six now Smiley, so didn't read. I'm not promoting smoking pot or cigarettes, or drinking booze -- don't really care if you do or don't -- probably wise that you don't. What I do care about is someone flat out lying.

Sorry for the long up coming post but here ya go. Smiley trying to reason with you is like beating my head against a brick wall. I and many others have provided MULTIPLE FACTS about the facts and myths about marijuana and you chose to ignore them or not believe them. Thats fine. Im gonna chose to ignore yours as well. We could argue all day. After this I'm done responding to you because it's a waste of my time and effort. You have consistently been disproven by myself and others multiple times. Enough is enough.

I have been driving for 3 years, 2 and a half without a license. I'm not saying I'm perfect. I break the law, but when I do, it's not dangerous. It's something like "Driving with a permit without a licensed driver."

An inexperienced UNLICENSED driver is not dangerous. What planet are you from? When you break the law it's ok and "not dangerous" but if someone smokes a little weed they are evil and deserve to be in prison for doing a dangerous drug In fact you are putting more lives at risk than someone who is smoking some weed in their house. HYPOCRITE HYPOCRITE
http://www.brake.org.uk/f...ed-drivers

Alcohol and Cigarettes are BAD, but legal. We can't do anything about it now. Marijuana=BAD, but illegal. WE CAN keep it that way. Right?? I mean why legalize ONE MORE bad thing? Seriously though, when you realize that your drug usage is a problem, when you can't keep a job or a family, you won't even have a voice to tell people how you feel. You won't be able to remember what you want to say. That's just from marijuana.

HAHAHAHAHAAHAHA. That comment is so stupid in so many ways. Where to begin. If every person that smoked weed ended up like your family, our country would be in HUGE trouble. You would have fit in well during alcohol prohibition. That worked out really well You might not like it but there has never been nor will be a 'Drug Free America" You must like spending 40 billion dollars a year on a failed war on drugs, having the highest prisoner rate in the world, and putting innocent non violent tax paying citizens in jail for smoking or growing a plant, that is impossible to overdose on. The effects of prohibition of marijuana are more dangerous than the drug itself.

This whole argument reminds me of the South Park episode "My Future Self and Me." Anyone that is interested in watching it can do so here
http://www.southparkstudi.../?season=6 It's on the bottom. It's for mature audiences only.

Has making marijuana illegal reduced the availability of it? NOPE Again, if you would of looked at some of my links you would see that Holland has LOWER teen marijuana use than in the United States. And it's LEGAL there. NO ONE IS SAYING IT IS GOOD FOR YOU or that you should engage in it. In the grand scheme of things though, it's not the worst thing you can do by far. All I am saying is it should be regulated by the government and available to adults. Like tobacco and booze. Who are you to tell an adult what they can and can't put in their body legally?

One quote that one of your "links" conveniently left out of the whole article

.."The bottom line is that I would not start warning my marijuana smokers that they are going to get testicular cancer," he said. "I don't think there's enough here to go forward with that message, at least not yet.

http://edition.cnn.com/20...ot.cancer/
There is the original article, The one you posted is cut and pasted to make it sound like marijuana is proven %100 to cause testicular cancer. And it might, but there isn't any solid proof.

Want me to do a case study on your fried brain. I'm not trying to spout off "propaganda." As I have previously stated, marijuana is something that does hit home because of EVERY experience in my life with it. Why wouldn't I work against it? Maybe you just don't see the effects of all your "friends" that do it? How many of them work at Taco John's?

My mother, smoked weed for medicinal purposes (anxiety for the record) now she has done meth many times, and I feel like only she can help herself. Brother-in-Law, just smokes weed every now and then... STEALS from his own mother to buy weed, and can't even get off the couch to find a job. My sister's boyfriend, started with weed, now is a cocaine dealer.

When you say that if you smoke weed you will turn to dealing coke, smoking meth, and stealing from your mom. That falls under the category of propaganda. So yeah you are in fact spouting off propaganda. You personally have had bad experiences with pot in the past. I can see why you don't like it, but it has warped your view of it in a negative way.

You know nothing of me, who my friends are, or what they do. Nice "taco john's" reference. Because that's where most potheads work right, Taco Johns. Did I ever admit in any of my posts that I smoke weed or do any other narcotic? Even if I did smoke marijuana, it's none of your business what I do. Shocker I know. If you don't know me, how would you know if i had a drug problem? Nice assumptions and nice personal attacks. Resorting to personal attacks just means that you are losing the argument. And since you said all of that, it's only fair that i get to say the following......

Your husband is a douche, he proved it with his "evil among us" thread. Way to be a man over the internet and spout personal family matters over a very public fourm, he even named last names and accused somone of drug dealing. That's douchebaggery at its finest. I'm glad none of your friends have never heard of me. (Because they must know EVERYONE right?) Cause if they are anything like you, I wouldn't want anything to do with them. Go practice some witchcraft or what ever it is you do in the woods. You and your posts are boring.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/2/2009)]

??douchebaggery??
Ok, yeah, personal attacks ae flying because I'm losing? Actually I'd like to rise above. You said you have friends and know lots of people who smoke weed and are just fine? Well, I know lots of people who smoke weed and are NOT fine. With all good there is bad. With all bad there is good. Marijuana has a lot of good properties I'm sure. They are discovering those everyday. Me giving my PERSONAL EXPERIENCES was not propaganda. It was truth and fact. Truth about a lot of correlations. You choose to only look at the "good" of marijuana. You must not have comprehended ANY of my posts very well. I did look at your links, "http://www.drugpolicy.org/marijuana/factsmyths/" was ALL pro marijuana. LOL they are working for a certain agenda.
I don't do marijuana, and I don't associate with people who do. I keep them out of my life for the same reason I keep people who drink out of my life. I don't do it, so why would I want to be around it? I don't want my daughter to grow up and try ANY harmful substance. OK?

You probably don't understand, and you probably never will. I understand where you are coming from. If we legalize it and tax it, our country would have more money, a better control on the "drug war," Less users. I just prefer that we try to eliminate usage Nathan. It's harder that way, but it's ultimately better.

You had some very convincing facts, but unlike my websites that were HONEST, you had only PRO Marijuana.

Next time your at school, in any science class, learn about the scientific method, and HOW MUCH you need to challenge everything that is out there.

[This message has been edited by Smiley (11/2/2009)]

Is there any chance we could get Eric Brandt, Rob Shipley, and Mary Quintus to post to this thread?

Addiction is a disease, not a weak will.

You seem to be addicted to replying to this thread, Polar Bear. Are you saying that your willingness to pound your head repeatedly against a brick wall and dig ever-deeper holes are merely symptoms of some disease?

For law enforcement to do this to this man is so cruel IMO...

http://blog.nj.com/njv_ed...hn_ra.html

IMO that was pretty wrong. He has a legitimate claim to grow. I feel bad that he didn't know, but if they can't prove he was dealing, let him go.

This was growing in plain view on a curb in Orem, Utah. It reached 7 feet high before anyone noticed it.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=8493803

That photo could be a centerfold in "Hi Times", Wendy.

Saying that I have a fried brain, a drug problem, and that my friends and I work at Taco Johns is rising above personal attacks? Ok

I do understand the risks and consequences of marijuana. and if i choose to engage or not engage in those risks, it is MY decision. There are risks to smoking weed. No one is saying there isn't. But again, the prohibition of marijuana and other drugs are causing more harm to society than the drug itself. How many families, and lives have been lost or torn apart because of the governments war on its own citizens? You cannot give me any "facts or links" to prove me wrong on that.

http://www.drugwarrant.co...ar-victim/
How sad it that link? Everyone should read it.

Again what is it with you and the "pro marijauana" websites. You named 2 out of the numerous ones i listed. WebMD, The Washington Post, Cnn, Forbes. If marijauanprocon was really a pro pot website, why would they have the CON part. Those really look and sound like "pro pot" websites NORML and MPP are pro pot websites. If you want to go down that road, i'm sure the Drug Abuse Institute of America is a fair and non biased source Your websites and links, are just as credible as mine, and what others have posted.

You will never ever ever in a million years eliminate drug use. Humans have used drugs since the dawn of time, and will continue to do so after we are long gone. So you keep trying to eliminate all usage Smiley. I'm sure you will be really successful Let me know how that goes.

Why don't you campaign against fast food if you don't like dangerous things. Or the rising prescription drug abuse problem in America. Both of which kill way more people and are way more dangerous than smoking some weed.(Remember weed has never caused a single death from overdosing) Talk about a futile effort on your part. Watch the movies Super Size Me, then watch Super High Me. and tell me what one is worse.

I leave you with a quote from my favorite movie stoner Dale Denton from Pineapple Express.

People have been smoking weed for thousands of years...they aren't going to stop anytime soon.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/2/2009)]

Is there any chance we could get Eric Brandt, Rob Shipley, and Mary Quintus to post to this thread?

any thread with quotes from "Ship", just gets better. Adding a little crazy never hurts.

This thread deserves a 5-Star-

Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers Award









Hands down winner.

There should be a thread for all time wacko's on mc.com. Gunnar got a good start a few posts back ago.

I had forgotten about the fabulous furry freak brothers. I like this one...

I was saying in the last post that I was going to rise above where I had previously sank. Yes, mentioning TACO JOHNS was such a personal attack. They have some good food.

I don't know how anyone missed this, or maybe no one mentioned it, but Nathan Jessup is a made up name... Good Fakery, but really now.
http://wikiality.wikia.com/Colonel_Nathan_Jessup

My name is Shannon Marie... what is yours?

See boys and girls - I've always said talking about pot would be fun. This thread rivals any political thread on the site. How about we throw in religion?

God made reefer so it's okay to use.

On your marks, get set, discuss. Wheeeeeeee!

Yeah because a character in "A Few Good Men" is named Nathan Jessup, that must mean there isn't anyone else with that name God you really know a lot about me. Where I work, the condition of my "drug problem". where my friends work. Am I going to have to notify the Internet Stalking Office, maybe I should contact Polar Bear on how I should proceed That was a joke.... laugh.

Going by your logic, you have a fake name too. For all I know you could of just copied this actresses name. But do I think that? No.
http://www.askmen.com/cel...dward.html
Nice try

Because YOU think I have a "fake name" my post are not as valid? That has to be the reason you brought it up. Just wondering because that's rich coming from someone who signed up as a "Smiley" But seriously my name is Nathan Robert Jessup. I go to school at the South Dakota School of Mines and Technology in Rapid City SD if you wanted to know that as well. You can believe it or not, I really don't care, or have to prove anything to anybody. What YOU think my real name is, really has nothing to do with this thread, or what is being discussed. Maybe no one brought it up, because "SHOCKER", it's not of any importance.

You don't really have a leg to stand on in this debate anymore, so you are pushing the focus off the subject at hand, onto other things like for example my name. Nice try. Kinda reminds me how Polar Bear couldn't back up her so called "facts" She resorted to personal accusations about the Webmaster and we all know what happened after that. Again you are in the same boat.

Steve, I love that you brought religion into it Now we can all fight even more. Lol

Genesis 1:29.
Then God said, "Behold, I have given you every plant yielding seed
that is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree which has
fruit yielding seed; it shall be food for you."

Timothy 4:4.
4:4 For everything created by God is good, and nothing is to be
rejected, if it is received with gratitude.

In no way am I religious nut. but isn't marijuana a "seed yielding plant"?

Just some fun facts on the "religious" side of it.

This quote from you Smiley has also been bugging me. And I haven't responded to it yet.

Marijuana=BAD, but illegal. WE CAN keep it that way. Right?? I mean why legalize ONE MORE bad thing?

Why should otherwise law abiding people who chose to engage in a proven safer alternative in marijuana than compared to tobacco and alcohol be considered criminals and treated as such???? Quit telling people what is bad or good or dangerous for them. They can make their own decisions with out you believe it or not. We don't need you to protect us.

You say you have personal experiences with pot that have shaped your view. So do I. I have seen way to many lives ruined, families torn apart, futures lost, potential wasted, people killed/hurt, SICK people being arrested and denied their medicine. All over a NATURAL PLANT that has been around since the dawn of time. For the hundredth time, The laws regarding marijuana are more harmful than the drug itself.

Please read the drug war victims link if you haven't already.

I don't think people should smoke, but do I tell them not to do it...no way. Do I think people who smoke and drink, deserve to be in jail or arrested for engaging in it. NO WAY.

[This message has been edited by Nathan Jessup (11/3/2009)]

You have kept this up an impressively long time Nathan. I've got to say though. You are wasting your time. Presenting facts to people who still believe Marijuana is a "gateway drug" and should be illegal is beating your head against a brick wall. If they get cancer and go on chemotherapy and by some miracle try smoking MJ for the nausea they'll quickly change their tune. Short of that they will stay in the dark. Like the apostle Paul, God often has to knock people off their donkeys to help them see the light. My unsolicited advice is to pity and pray for the ignorati. Debating them only strengthens the titanium walls around their minds. Peace to all.

I already backed up my facts.
You backed up yours.
We aren't the only people in the world fighting over this.
It really seems to be a BIG deal to you, so whatever. I really do have other things to research, I personally don't need to fight over weed because I don't do it and I don't associate with people who I know do it. Let's move on to religion?

My religion (the part I practice) looks down on any psychoactive drug, it ruins a connection with nature. Wiccan works with karma a lot, so there really isn't any sin. But anything that screws up your connection to reality and the world around you is A BAD THING, as you can't do any good work or blessings.

I really, really hesitate to get involved here but...

In no way am I religious nut. but isn't marijuana a "seed yielding plant"?

Just some fun facts on the "religious" side of it.

You might want to consider the following:

19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires.

The word translated as witchcraft in verse 20 is the greek word "pharmakeia", which is the origin of the english word pharmacy. The context is that the use of mind altering drugs is part of the way sinners behave. Check out Thayers note here.
http://www.blueletterbibl...5331&t=KJV

I think you are hard-pressed to say that smoking joints is ok with God.

[This message has been edited by Richard Bonine, Jr (11/3/2009)]