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 What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/19/2012 10:32:13 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Bridgier, 7/20/2012 6:58:44 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Gunnar Emilsson, 7/20/2012 9:14:52 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/20/2012 11:40:54 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Bridgier, 7/20/2012 10:19:09 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/21/2012 6:41:42 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Richard Bonine, Jr., 7/21/2012 7:57:09 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/21/2012 8:10:33 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, howdy, 7/21/2012 8:14:29 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Levi Forman, 7/21/2012 8:49:50 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Bridgier, 7/21/2012 9:47:31 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/21/2012 9:48:30 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, howdy, 7/21/2012 11:50:54 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/21/2012 12:23:43 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Bridgier, 7/21/2012 10:26:46 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Buck Showalter, 7/21/2012 11:17:13 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/22/2012 4:47:33 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Richard Bonine, Jr., 7/22/2012 6:40:47 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/22/2012 7:13:30 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, howdy, 7/22/2012 7:55:38 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Levi Forman, 7/22/2012 8:08:30 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 7/22/2012 10:29:04 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Hal Neumann, 7/22/2012 11:32:12 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Buck Showalter, 7/22/2012 11:47:17 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Amorette Allison, 7/22/2012 2:14:49 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, howdy, 7/22/2012 3:16:55 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Levi Forman, 7/22/2012 11:47:36 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 8/8/2012 4:15:03 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, howdy, 8/8/2012 4:29:38 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Buck Showalter, 8/8/2012 4:34:31 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Bridgier, 8/8/2012 4:36:08 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, atomicg, 8/9/2012 8:23:11 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Admin MilesCity.com Webmaster, 8/9/2012 3:12:21 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 8/31/2012 1:04:35 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Richard Bonine, Jr., 8/31/2012 1:11:17 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Gunnar Emilsson, 8/31/2012 1:34:53 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Bridgier, 8/31/2012 2:26:06 PM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Elizabeth Emilsson, 9/13/2012 10:08:30 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, LAURIE STARK, 9/13/2012 11:09:02 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?, Kacey, 9/13/2012 11:09:04 AM
 RE: What about Gary Johnson?Donator Jeri Dalbec, 9/13/2012 12:21:30 PM
 Subject: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Thu Jul 19 10:32:13 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
I've been doing some reading up on Gary Johnson. That man makes a lot of sense. Great alternative to the Obama/Romney headache.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Bridgier  Posted: Fri Jul 20 6:58:44 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Third parties are a trap. But as Johnson's going to be siphoning votes from Romney more so than Obama, I say go for it.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Gunnar Emilsson  Posted: Fri Jul 20 9:14:52 AM MDT 2012 From: - NY
I'd vote for Gary Johnson over Mittens hands down, if they were the only two dogs in the race. How the Republican party has brainwashed 46% of the public is one of the great mysteries of our time. The Libertarian party by far represents the traditional conservative values of our founding fathers. The only people who should vote Republican is the upper 1% of the tax brackets.

But there are three candidates, and despite my disagreement with several of his policies, President Obama is by far the most qualified to lead America into the 21st century.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Fri Jul 20 11:40:54 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
I agree to a certain extent. I am so tired of giving the Democrats and Republicns chance after chance after chance. Maybe Obama IS more qualified than Romney. He's had his chance and he was mediocre at best. Romney, well as far as I aim concerned, he is so out of touch with the common person that it scares me. He is a joke.

Me...I'm voting for Johnson, not because it will take votes away from the other two but because I am so ready for real change and some fresh ideas!
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Bridgier  Posted: Fri Jul 20 10:19:09 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
someone really doesn't understand how the american electoral system works.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sat Jul 21 6:41:42 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Wow, thanks. It's not voting for who you think would do the best job? Therein lies the problem. And...by the way...I am not dumb, stupid, or rude. Someone needs to take a lesson.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Richard Bonine, Jr.  Posted: Sat Jul 21 7:57:09 AM MDT 2012 From: - CA
While I like Gary Johnson and he may help the liberitarian cause get above the 15% threshold, at the end of the day you must you must understand that liberitarians are really nothing more than republicans with crack pipes.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sat Jul 21 8:10:33 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Now THAT was funny!!
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: howdy  Posted: Sat Jul 21 8:14:29 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Sadly, the way the electoral system is set up, the only ones with a chance of winning are either Democrats or Republicans...I would dearly love to see this change or done away with and just go with the popular vote...
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Levi Forman  Posted: Sat Jul 21 8:49:50 AM MDT 2012 From: - CA
As long as people such as yourself keep voting out of fear instead of trying to make things better, the two parties aren't going anywhere, and they are really good at scaring people.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Bridgier  Posted: Sat Jul 21 9:47:31 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Until we change how we choose electors, the two party system isn't going anywhere. It's not voting out of fear, it's rationally choosing to support the party that can actually accomplish something. Third parties can't get electors, therefore, they can't get elected. All they can do is damage the chances of the major party candidate that's actually closest to their philosophy.

If you want to vote third party, you might as well vote for the easter bunny, for all the good it does.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sat Jul 21 9:48:30 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
When was the last time the "two parties" took us anywhere? Longer than I care to remember. As for the scary part? I don't vote because I am scared. I vote because I want change and voting is my way of telling them so. Get out of the groove and become a FREE THINKER.Do what's right for a change!!
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: howdy  Posted: Sat Jul 21 11:50:54 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
But Laurie, other than a republican or democrat, there is no chance for anyone to win...due to the current electoral system...so voting otherwise is a waste...Understand?
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sat Jul 21 12:23:43 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Understand? Yes. Remember, I am no dummy. So because my candidate won't win, I shouldn't vote for him. Um, OK.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Bridgier  Posted: Sat Jul 21 10:26:46 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Exactly. If your candidate doesn't have the possibility of achieving the plurality of the vote within your state, all voting for this person will do is harm the candidacy of the viable candidate most closest to him/her in philosophy.

A vote for Gary Johnson's the same as a vote for Obama, so please, vote for him twice if you can.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Buck Showalter  Posted: Sat Jul 21 11:17:13 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
We're so procreateed.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sun Jul 22 4:47:33 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Ya, what Buck said.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Richard Bonine, Jr.  Posted: Sun Jul 22 6:40:47 AM MDT 2012 From: - CA
In a two-person race between Romney and Obama, Romney has no chance of gaining enough electoral votes to win. Voting for Johnson takes votes away from Obama and gives Romney a chance.

[This message has been edited by Richard Bonine, Jr. (7/22/2012)]
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sun Jul 22 7:13:30 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
And not voting for the person I feel would do the best job takes away MY rights as an American citizen.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: howdy  Posted: Sun Jul 22 7:55:38 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
But Laurie, why would you just throw away your vote by voting for someone that doesn't have a chance as long as the electoral college is in place?? I agree it is your right as a citizen to vote for whomever you wish, but wouldn't you like your vote to count at least??? and by doesn't have a chance, I mean, if the majority of Americans voted for the same person, he still would not win...
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Levi Forman  Posted: Sun Jul 22 8:08:30 AM MDT 2012 From:
If there was only one candidate, we could ALL vote for the winner.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Sun Jul 22 10:29:04 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
So voting for someone I totally don't care about because the person I do has no chance of winning? I don't think so. I will vote for whom I think is the best candidate...I don't think my vote is a wasted vote, nor do the hundreds of thousands who also vote Libertarian or Independent or those who vote for their dog. Doesn't matter. The dog probably could do just as good as job in the long run. Don't get me wrong, I get it. I truly do. However, I will agree to disagree.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Hal Neumann  Posted: Sun Jul 22 11:32:12 AM MDT 2012 From:
We could try to change the system. Replace the Electoral College with direct vote for President. It's probably not an impossible thing to do. It would be darned hard to pull off, it would take years (maybe a generation or more to pull off), but I think it could be done.

It would certainly be a game changer - I can't, of course, tell in advance if it would change the game for the better. I can imagine at least one scenario that would make it worse. But I think it's worth a shot.

Of course the real game changer is still meaningful campaign finance reform - taking the money out the equation. But, I don't know that even a sustained, multi-generational effort can make that one happen.

I do know that if you want to see how similar both major parties truly are - if you need yet another example of how firmly money controls both parties - pursue both reforms. Threaten the Major's monopoly on the White House - threaten to choke off their access to corporate cash and you'll see bipartisanship come to forefront in DC.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Buck Showalter  Posted: Sun Jul 22 11:47:17 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
I wonder why they didn't install a bi-partisan republic in Iraq?

Oh wait, no I don't.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Amorette Allison  Posted: Sun Jul 22 2:14:49 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
I just read an article -- sorry, I don't remember where -- that pointed out how few votes actually count. The entire state of Montana doesn't count. It will go Romney with its three lousy electoral votes and nobody, including Romney, will care. There are a very few battle ground counties in a very few battle ground states with a few swing voters. When it comes down to it, those are the only votes that will matter.

Unless the Supremes start playing games again.

You could vote for Pat Paulsen as much as this Johnson fellow and it won't make a difference. In local and state elections, your vote counts. For president, it's just spitting in the wind.

I will vote for Obama because the alternative is so much worse, but I know, in the long run, it won't matter.

Ain't it grand?
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: howdy  Posted: Sun Jul 22 3:16:55 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Agree Amorette, sad but true...
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Levi Forman  Posted: Sun Jul 22 11:47:36 PM MDT 2012 From:
Hal Neumann wrote:
We could try to change the system. Replace the Electoral College with direct vote for President. It's probably not an impossible thing to do. It would be darned hard to pull off, it would take years (maybe a generation or more to pull off), but I think it could be done.

It would certainly be a game changer - I can't, of course, tell in advance if it would change the game for the better. I can imagine at least one scenario that would make it worse. But I think it's worth a shot.

Of course the real game changer is still meaningful campaign finance reform - taking the money out the equation. But, I don't know that even a sustained, multi-generational effort can make that one happen.

I do know that if you want to see how similar both major parties truly are - if you need yet another example of how firmly money controls both parties - pursue both reforms. Threaten the Major's monopoly on the White House - threaten to choke off their access to corporate cash and you'll see bipartisanship come to forefront in DC.


Nice post Hal. At the risk of sounding like Howdy, I agree 100%.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Wed Aug 8 4:15:03 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
It is vital that voters in every state have real choices in November, choices that are not narrowed down for them by the two so-called major parties. Quote from Gary Johnson.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: howdy  Posted: Wed Aug 8 4:29:38 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
that system isn't easily changed, as the electoral college would require a lot to be rid of IMO...Read up on it...
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Buck Showalter  Posted: Wed Aug 8 4:34:31 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
howdy wrote:
that system isn't easily changed, as the electoral college would require a lot to be rid of IMO...Read up on it...


I can become a bajillionaire or rely on everyone to pull their heads out. Somebody message me on election day. Let me know who raised the most money so I can vote be sure to vote for them.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Bridgier  Posted: Wed Aug 8 4:36:08 PM MDT 2012 From: - ID
Rereading the thread, I was wondering if you could expand on this:

He's had his chance and he was mediocre at best


Specifically, what would have made his first administration better than mediocre, in your eyes?
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: atomicg  Posted: Thu Aug 9 8:23:11 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7wC4...6CB1A2C94&playnext=2

An explanation of the electoral college.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Admin MilesCity.com Webmaster  Posted: Thu Aug 9 3:12:21 PM MDT 2012 From: - CA
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Fri Aug 31 1:04:35 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
People say you waste your vote by voting Libertarian. The only wasted vote is a compromised vote and Obama or Romney are compromised votes. I'm not voting for someone because they're slightly better than the other guy. If the GOP sees 20% of their votes going to Gary Johnson their message will change.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Richard Bonine, Jr.  Posted: Fri Aug 31 1:11:17 PM MDT 2012 From: - WY
I agree Laurie. The whole mantra about not voting for a 3rd party candidate because the candidate in the other big-box party might win is nothing more than voting out of fear. Voting out of fear is never going to cause the changes that needs to occur. Either Jill Stien or Gary Johnson would be preferable to what the big box-store parties are offering.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Gunnar Emilsson  Posted: Fri Aug 31 1:34:53 PM MDT 2012 From: - NY
I also agree with Laurie. One should vote for whatever candidate best shares your convictions and beliefs on what direction you think this country should be going.

As annoyed as I was at the time for the people who voted for Ralph Nader over Al Gore in 2000, that certainly was their right, and I now respect that.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Bridgier  Posted: Fri Aug 31 2:26:06 PM MDT 2012 From: - ID
While I was hoping that LAURIE would answer the question I posed to her above, I certainly respect her right to vote early and often for Gary Johnson, and I hope she encourages all of her conservative friends to do so as well, particularly those friends that live in Pennsylvania, Ohio, or Florida.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Elizabeth Emilsson  Posted: Thu Sep 13 10:08:30 AM MDT 2012 From: - CO
I watched an interview with Gary Johnson on Martin Bashir's program, yesterday. He was quite impressive. He is still fighting to get on the ballot in several states and has been challengedin court by the Republicans in Virginia, even though his approval rating is now about 4%. He could bring alot of intelligence on salient points to the debates. It's amazing how both parties manage to stifle the democratic process.
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: LAURIE STARK  Posted: Thu Sep 13 11:09:02 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
I like what Gary Johnson had to say also! People need to start listening!
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Kacey  Posted: Thu Sep 13 11:09:04 AM MDT 2012 From: - MT
I hope she encourages all of her conservative friends to do so as well, particularly those friends that live in Pennsylvania, Ohio, or Florida.


I certainly agree!
 Subject: RE: What about Gary Johnson?
Author: Donator Jeri Dalbec  Posted: Thu Sep 13 12:21:30 PM MDT 2012 From: - MT
Especially, Ohio! I saw another Independent Pres. candidate on TV yesterday...a Mr. Goode from Virginia, I believe. He feels that he will be on the ballot in 18 States.
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